Comic News Recap with Regie Collects: The State of The MCU, DC's Plan to Avoid Superhero Fatigue, and Compact Comics (The Short Box Podcast Ep. 408)
[00:00:00] Intro music plays
[00:00:26] Badr: Yo, short box nation, welcome back to the podcast. Thanks for pressing play. And thanks for being here with us today. If you're new to the show, welcome. My name is Badr and this is the short box podcast, the comic book talk show that brings you the best conversations about comics and pop culture inspired by comics.
[00:00:46] Badr: This is episode 408 and today we're recapping some recent comic news and announcements from this week, AKA last week, by the time most of you hear this. Now I'm not alone in this mission today. This is not an interview episode. So I've got a crew here with me. All right here with me in the short box studio and hold it down on mic number two is the, a special Edmund Dansart, what up Ed?
[00:01:06] Badr: Hey, what's up, man? How you doing Ed? Good. I'm good. Normal listeners might not know this, but you dropped a little extra bonus, a self hosted bonus episode over on Patreon. Yeah, I did a
[00:01:16] Ed: little mini review of Jinji Ito's Gyo for Halloween. So I figured it fit the, uh, fit the season. And I'm just trying to get my set up so I can start, you know, adding a little bit more to the, uh, the Patreon
[00:01:29] Badr: listeners.
[00:01:30] Badr: That's what I like to hear, man. Look, I, I, I'm all here for everyone branching out, getting their own spinoff shows. All right. And anyway, I can help out. And not only that, but Ed, but, uh, genuinely. It was a great concept. You got, uh, you got some good commentary from the, uh, from the patrons over on Patreon.
[00:01:44] Badr: So I'm looking forward to more stuff from you. Awesome. Appreciate it. And on mic number three is a special guest co host making his short box debut. I met him at New York Comic Con. Finally got to make his acquaintance. He's someone I've been following online for a minute now. So I'm excited that we were able to make this happen so quickly.
[00:02:00] Badr: Online, he goes by Regie Collects. He's the winner of six 2022 comic book community awards. I didn't even know there was community awards. That's pretty awesome. And he describes himself as your friendly neighborhood bodybuilder and comic book collector. Someone that got to meet him in person. The former definitely holds true as well as the latter.
[00:02:18] Badr: Short Box Nation, let's welcome Regie Collects to the show. Regie. How you doing, brother? Welcome to the show, man.
[00:02:25] Regie Collects: Anytime I'm feeling bad. About myself, I'm going to play that back because there is nothing but the warm and fuzzies that come through the microphone, uh, when, or the headset, when I, and I hear that, uh, man, I still, I wish I still look as good as I used to back in the day.
[00:02:43] Regie Collects: Now, I'm just a lot of
[00:02:44] Badr: bragging.
[00:02:46] Regie Collects: I'm just somebody's dad now, brother. I'm on the sidelines at the soccer match trying to not huff and puff as I play with my kid whenever they have a break, you know? The
[00:02:55] Ed: listeners can't see he's juggling kettlebells while he's
[00:02:58] Regie Collects: saying this. Oh, oh, Ed, well done,
[00:03:05] Badr: sir. Here's the thing, Ed.
[00:03:06] Badr: Listeners can see this because we are recording video. This That's right. As well. That's right. So, okay. So if you want to see the Sulzer for, uh, for yourself, ladies tense, , check out the video version of this podcast. But Reggie, tell me about these six, uh, the comic book community awards. What, what, what are they?
[00:03:20] Badr: Uh,
[00:03:21] Regie Collects: so Bader, there was a little, little, little wrong there. Little wrong. Uh, I'm the winner of 10 .
[00:03:27] Badr: Oh. Oh, wow. Well, where's that at? Let me go ahead and give another one. Yeah. So yeah, come
[00:03:32] Ed: on. Sorry, my bro. You short
[00:03:34] Regie Collects: him for 20, So the channel is the, the most winning, uh, YouTube content channel out there, right?
[00:03:46] Regie Collects: Focused on comics, right? So the comic book community awards has been going on for the last couple of years. Uh, put together by some really awesome people. And I've been fortunate to win multiple awards and, and honestly, whether it's, whether it's, it's six, it's four, it's 10. I am honored that people would actually take the time to nominate the channel and then vote for the channel and then, and then have me win.
[00:04:12] Regie Collects: It is just, it's
[00:04:13] Badr: awesome. I want to tell them what were the awards themselves? What were they for?
[00:04:16] Regie Collects: Oh, brother, there's there's a host of them. So I think it's, uh, most entertaining, um, community builder, uh, channel of the year, uh, like best ongoing series because I had a couple of series like, uh, the ready set go, uh, show that I used to do on Sunday and then.
[00:04:34] Regie Collects: Comics today. I think comics today, one for Wednesday. I mean, we, we had a string of hundreds of shows for both of those, but, uh, you're putting me on the spot. Cause I can't remember them all too many.
[00:04:46] Ed: Can't even remember the
[00:04:47] Regie Collects: community builder. The community builder is one that I'm particularly proud of.
[00:04:52] Regie Collects: Because, you know, anybody that's part of of comics knows that the community is what it's all about. Right? And the fact that, um, that the channel was honored to receive that is, is huge, man, because it's all about the community. And I put out a lot of content that may not get a ton of views. But the, the, the videos are designed to make the community stronger.
[00:05:14] Regie Collects: It's they're designed to help people be smarter about the hobby of comic book collecting. And so again, to win these awards is it's
[00:05:22] Badr: huge. Wow. Well, I love hearing that because you know, it's easy. I think to get like, especially as a content creator, regardless of you're talking comics, YouTube, or doing podcasting, I think it's easy to get, you know, uh, in your head.
[00:05:35] Badr: About views and numbers and sometimes forget like what the mission was like, you know, making a positive impact on this community, you know, uh, contributing in a positive way in a meaningful way,
[00:05:45] Regie Collects: having fun was, was honestly like my number one, you know, I used to watch these guys like, uh, Jim Mint and Reaper Tate and ETA Nick, uh, and sell my, sell my comics, uh, back in the day, these guys were on YouTube and they were just having fun.
[00:06:02] Regie Collects: And I was like, man, I want, I want to have some fun, you know, because I don't have these friends in my, in my everyday life that were in the comics. And I was like, I just want to have fun. And then that fun led me to spending lots of money, like doing unboxings. And I was like, well, I can't do unboxings anymore.
[00:06:18] Regie Collects: So I was like, well, I've got to come up with something else. And that something else became, well, how can I give back to the community that has given me so much in terms of, you know, just making the hobby more enjoyable because you can. Yeah. Talk to other folks that are into the same nerdy stuff that you are, you know,
[00:06:35] Badr: well said, well said.
[00:06:36] Badr: And I want to definitely talk to you about some of the other projects and things that you've got going on. I mean, from your comic collecting book and then your very own comic series and publishing company. Definitely want to get into that more, but yo, welcome to the show. I'm glad we were able to make this happen very quickly.
[00:06:50] Badr: And I want to give a big shout out to, uh, uh, our guy, Kyle Willis, a mutual friend of ours that actually introduced us. We met at his, uh, booth, um, uh, at New York Comic Con. And, you know, it was easy going from there. So, glad to make this happen, man. All right, let's go back to the listeners. Listeners, we got a full show for you today.
[00:07:07] Badr: In the immortal words of my guy, Jon Stewart, we got things to talk about. We've got things to talk about. We have three primary topics to cover today, and those include a report put out by Variety that outlines in excruciating detail the quote unquote crisis at Marvel, their words, not mine. We'll also be talking about DC's plan to avoid superhero fatigue, kind of like a pseudo response to everything going on at Marvel and how they hope to not be, you know, stuck in the same boat.
[00:07:36] Badr: DC also announced a new line of comics called Compact Comics that they're launching next year with the hopes of getting into big box stores and attracting a whole new batch and crop of readers to comics. And like most of our news recap episodes, and really just all of our episodes, We've got timestamps, uh, for every topic we'll be discussing today in the show notes.
[00:07:57] Badr: So if you're someone that wants to jump around, or if you just want to hear a specific topic, check the show notes for timestamps. You'll also find, hint hint, you'll also find a link to our merch store. Indie show notes, and you can cop one of these awesome short box corner box shirts that I'm wearing on the video version of the podcast.
[00:08:17] Badr: We're actually running a sale on everything in our merch store from now until the end of the year. You can save 10 percent off your entire order. When you use the discount code, yo, Y O O just two O's. We still have a few gauntlet hats. I know we've got a few shirts in different sizes available. And if we're just being honest, we're trying to move some old inventory to make room for some new stuff.
[00:08:39] Badr: I think it's. I think we're well overdue some new designs, some new shirts and merch. So if you've been wanting to support the show, or if you've been wanting to grab some merch from us, now would be the time. Visit theshortboxstore. bigcartel. com to do some early holiday shopping, and don't forget to use the discount code YOYO to save 10%.
[00:09:01] Badr: Shameless plugs aside, let's get into our first topic, and maybe the one that made the biggest splash. Across the online comic community and just, just online in general, I had a lot of people talking this past week about this article that was put out by Variety on Wednesday, November 1st, written by Tatiana Siegel.
[00:09:20] Badr: It's a 2000 plus word report and is titled Crisis at Marvel, Jonathan Major's Backup Plans, The Marvel's Reshoots, Reviving Original Avengers, and More Issues Revealed. The title basically says it all. The article goes into a lot of detail. Explaining the various challenges and issues, uh, that the MCU has faced these last three plus years.
[00:09:43] Badr: All right. We're talking about, uh, issues in regards to just subpar, uh, just subpar product, right from their movies to their, their TV series, uh, to the reception from fans and critics alike. I don't think it's crazy to say that Marvel has struggled to, uh, recapture some of that magic and, and that flame they had with the earlier phases, phases one through three.
[00:10:07] Badr: I think the MCU struggled to find a good footing with phase four. I think they had a lot more questionable, uh, shows and TV and the reception just was, was, was lukewarm among fans and critics alike. Granted, there are exceptions, uh, to that. There was definitely some shining. Uh, some shining moments from Phase 4, uh, Shang Chi, Spider Man No Way Home, uh, I Enjoy Dr.
[00:10:30] Badr: Dre in Multiverse and Madness, uh, Black Panther 2, uh, but overall, it feels that this current phase, phase, this previous phase, Phase 4, and even into Phase 5, uh, the MCU just isn't, just isn't doing it. For most fans and critics and even, uh, other industry professionals and directors and actors, um, all have something to say about the MCU.
[00:10:54] Badr: And this article attempts to paint a comprehensive timeline and really kind of pull the curtain back into the various challenges and problems they've been facing. Challenges and problems, such as Jonathan Major's legal issues and how that's put the studio in a very peculiar spot in regards to their lead antagonist that's supposed to carry the franchise into the next few years.
[00:11:16] Badr: It's not something that they can rely on. So they're, you know, the article talks about potential pivots and then maybe changing the idea, changing the focus from Kang the Conqueror to maybe, you know, Dr. Doom was mentioned in the article. The article also goes into detail about some of the challenges with their visual effects department.
[00:11:33] Badr: You know, uh, this department being forced to work long hours with very little overtime pay to meet these unrealistic and last minute schedules, and the strain that that's put on, on those teams and those employees. Through the article, we also learn about the very costly reshoots for She Hulk in the upcoming Marvels movie, and, and how a lack Of, of basic script development and, and quality of control has led to issues with other projects and pre production projects like that, like Blade.
[00:12:01] Badr: And beloved MCU maestro, Kevin Feige isn't spared either. He catches, uh, he catches some shots in this article regarding him just being spread too thin and just being a control freak and, and dropping the ball on, on a few occasions. And there's more going on at the house of mouse, if you will, uh, that the article goes in.
[00:12:20] Badr: into. Those were just some of the key takeaways that I found interesting that I wanted to share and kick us off with. Um, I'm gonna take a stop right here because I feel like I've been talking a lot and I want to hear, uh, Reggie, I'm gonna go to you because I, I, I think you covered this and this is something that Reggie I wanted to mention.
[00:12:35] Badr: I really like your content on Instagram. You managed to do basically these episodes in very digestible Uh, you know, bite sized contents, you know, a minute, sometimes a minute, sometimes less, maybe a little more. But I wanted to hear your initial opinions on this. Like, was there anything from this article?
[00:12:52] Badr: That was new to you, that was, you know, glaring, that kind of gave you maybe a better insight into what's going on? There's a lot to
[00:12:58] Regie Collects: unpack here, man. There's no doubt about it, right? Um, and I've been covering a lot of this stuff, you know, on YouTube and also on Instagram, because there's a lot to talk about, right?
[00:13:09] Regie Collects: Um, what, what I will say... Is that while the M. C. U. 's performance as of late hasn't been what we have come to expect, I think that there's reasons for that during the pandemic. They try to push out as much content as they possibly could. Because they had a captive audience, right? And they, their goal was to cram or to push out and cram down, you know, the channels as much content as they possibly could, because people were sitting at home with nothing else to do.
[00:13:45] Regie Collects: And so when you, when you do that, when you accelerate your plans to take advantage of a once in a lifetime type of thing, something's going to suffer. Right. And what suffered is the quality of what was coming out. And a lot of people like to blame the writers for that. But I think that, uh, to one of your points earlier, I think a lot of people are to blame, right?
[00:14:07] Regie Collects: The writers maybe took some shortcuts. The, the directors, the producers took a lot of shortcuts, right? One of the things that we've learned is that Marvel was actually green lighting. A lot of these TV shows without actually following standard procedure in terms of doing a pilot. And evaluating that pilot and giving feedback and tweaking it, they were saying, here's the cash.
[00:14:29] Regie Collects: You've got a story, go, go shoot the thing. And so they were writing it. They were filming it. They were then trying to fix it in post production, which is why costs were going up like crazy. And that's why they had to do all those reshoots. They were doing it for the movies. They were also doing it for the TV shows.
[00:14:45] Regie Collects: And as a result of trying to cram out all of this content, it backfired 33 movies and 12. Uh, TV shows, if you include, you know, the stuff that's come out on Disney plus, right? That is a lot of content right now by that same token. I think people should be very thankful to the M. C. U. because 30 billion dollars over the last decade has literally kept the lights on for Hollywood.
[00:15:12] Regie Collects: So people like Martin Scorsese should actually be thankful that the M. C. U. has existed. Because without the MCU, uh, Hollywood would be in poor shape, but, but like you, I've been talking for a minute. So I'll go ahead and pause to say.
[00:15:31] Badr: Did anything stand out to you, Ed, as far as, like, any of these challenges or, or, you know, behind the scenes things?
[00:15:36] Badr: Did anything stand out? Reading these
[00:15:38] Ed: articles and, like you said, there's a lot of, a lot of people to blame, but even as far as the, on the creative side of it, too, that I've read that there's a lot of people who don't want to do Marvel projects because of the Creative constraints because you have to fit this broader narrative that they want to tie this next phase with a new big bad.
[00:15:57] Ed: And plus, like you were saying, you know, they were, they had a captive audience that are also trying to sell subscriptions to Disney plus too. So they wanted, you know, they didn't want just a bunch of old Mickey mouse cartoons on there. They wanted to attract new customers too. So they had, they're building a whole new platform of a whole new way to, you know, basically view this entertainment.
[00:16:18] Ed: And it's like that first, I mean, they had a decade plus of. Run, run, that's lightning in a bottle that you cannot recreate and you cannot sustain. Um, so it's, and I know it's, you know, this is a corporate thing after all, you know, it's, it can make cool, creative things, but they're looking at the money, you know, they want money.
[00:16:42] Ed: They want to squeeze every cent out of these IP that they paid a ton of money to get that in like Star Wars, but they, they feel like. You know, if nothing is out in six months, people are going to go elsewhere for their entertainment dollar, you know,
[00:16:57] Badr: you know, speaking of speaking about that, that bar for success, there was, uh, a part of this report that I, that I noted here where the kind of outlines like this sense of unrealistic expectations for success and somewhere in this article, it mentions that if, if a movie doesn't hit, uh, half a billion dollars to them is a failure, Yeah, and you know what other obviously, I think it's safe to say every movie studio would love to hit half a billion, but what other studio or any other company has those type of goals?
[00:17:28] Badr: It could only be someone that has kind of pin themselves in this. You know what I'm saying? You get to see the corner that they put themselves in where it's success. They're so used to everything being a hit. I think Reggie, you had mentioned that, you know, the 30 billion over 32 films. 30 billion over 11 years of the MCU, you know, from Iron Man to Endgame, 30 billion is more than some country's GDP, you know, like, that is wild to think of.
[00:17:53] Badr: So, you know, it's like, how, how do you, when you've been to the top, how do you go back down? How do you adjust, you know, what your parameters for success is? Like, it's, it's almost unmanageable. But you have to.
[00:18:06] Regie Collects: Yeah, that is the business, right? And here's why. One, you cannot sustain that level of excellence.
[00:18:12] Regie Collects: You can't. When you look at the movie industry, it has not recovered from the pandemic. When you look at total box office and the total number of movie tickets that are being sold, it's not even close. 2019 to 2023, it's not close. So your expectations and your definition of success has to change because the economy is different and the landscape in which you are playing, i.
[00:18:43] Regie Collects: e. movie theaters, has changed. Half billion dollars, that's, that's Oppenheimer and Barbie aside, that, that potentially will not happen for a while unless the quality just skyrockets all of a sudden, which is possible.
[00:19:00] Badr: There was a line that mentions that normally Disney does not, um, they normally only engage employees and I guess friends and families and employees for their movie screenings, like to get like feedback and for the marvels, which this article goes into a lot of detail about like why the marvels, even though it hasn't been released is already kind of set to fail, you know, is a prime example of, you know, the fall of the MCU, if you will.
[00:19:26] Badr: But I found that pretty fascinating that they've. Yeah. I guess it's not, uh, it's not routine for them to just, like, uh, have a test audience. And I think, Reggie, it goes back to what you're saying, where they've maybe cut... They've been cutting making these shortcuts and cutting corners and you know, this is coming to light But I thought that was pretty fascinating that wait You're only showing these movies and pre screening these movies to like your employees and friends and family.
[00:19:49] Badr: That's great boss. Yeah You gonna get an honest opinion? So I guess, so I guess the show, the marvels,
[00:19:57] Regie Collects: your boss sits there and faces you as you watch, just waiting for you to, you know, make a funny face that, that, you know, as a marketer myself, there is no way in the world that I would release something to the public that has not been first evaluated by other people like that.
[00:20:15] Regie Collects: That's just, that's crazy. But, but again, they shot half of daredevil reborn the new daredevil season. Without ever looking at the footage. And then they looked at the footage and they were like, this footage isn't good. You have
[00:20:30] Ed: to put controls in place. You left the lens cap on the
[00:20:32] Badr: camera the whole time.
[00:20:34] Badr: I mean, you
[00:20:35] Regie Collects: have to put controls in place to evaluate what you're doing, man.
[00:20:38] Ed: Yeah, they do. There used to be a thing called dailies. That was like, basically you look over the footage and you see what you need to reshoot or need to, you know, change the lighting or however, you know, whatever movie terms you want to use.
[00:20:48] Ed: That's crazy. You just turn the
[00:20:49] Regie Collects: camera on and just shoot, brother. And go.
[00:20:52] Badr: But I was surprised to see the stat in there that said that one episode of She Hulk cost them 25 million an episode. Which was more than, I guess, like, any of the season finale episodes of Game of Thrones. Which we all know, I forgot what the price of any of those episodes were.
[00:21:07] Badr: But those are very CGI heavy movies. There seems to be a lot of internal drama within MCU. Them bleeding money with things like She Hulk and, you know, the price of visual effects and the strain that it's having on that department and, you know, how unhappy those folks are.
[00:21:22] Ed: And them not caring to put it out just because they need that content
[00:21:25] Badr: out there.
[00:21:26] Badr: And then, you know, you start seeing some of the turmoil within, you know, them firing the head of their visual effects department and finding any reason, right? Like, oh wait, she started promoting this other movie and we were, you know, She Hulk is on fire. You know what I'm saying? Like it paints, everyone is pointing fingers at each other within the organization themselves.
[00:21:45] Regie Collects: I think that you're making some good points, right? Because you know, the, the challenge is we have maybe too much visibility into what is happening inside these organizations, because what's happening here potentially isn't any different from any other organization, uh, or maybe any other entertainment company.
[00:22:08] Regie Collects: We are simply, uh. Exposing that stuff to sunlight and then scrutinizing the heck out of it. Like that woman that was fired, she violated her contract, like, and they gave her three shots on goal. Like, we don't think you should do this. You, Hey, you shouldn't do this. Hey, if you do this, we're going to fire you.
[00:22:27] Regie Collects: And they ended up firing her, but you know, they, they burn through a lot of capital, right? The movies cost somewhere between 175 million to 250 million. I think the most expensive was Black Panther 2, which was shot during the pandemic. And so you've got all those costs. And I think She Hulk was also filmed during those time that during that time, heavy CGI.
[00:22:49] Regie Collects: People were probably working from home and all that other kind of stuff, which is why it's so expensive. But when you look at She Hulk, I think when you look at the data, I think, uh, what is it? 1. 5 million people actually tuned in to watch She Hulk the first week that it debuted, which is the same as Hawkeye, which was a show that was actually pretty well received.
[00:23:09] Regie Collects: It actually beat out Secret Wars and Miss Marvel. But how a lot of people will say that show was terrible, right? Was it really terrible or were there a lot of people that just hated the, the, the, the person that was behind it and the way that She Hulk was depicted and the way that Daredevil was depicted?
[00:23:29] Regie Collects: Was it really that terrible? I don't know. I was entertained until the twerking started. And I was like, Oh, maybe twerking's not the right thing to
[00:23:38] Badr: do. You know, um, I wonder how much that twerking scene cost them. You know, Oh,
[00:23:43] Regie Collects: brother, brother, Junk doesn't move like that
[00:23:50] Regie Collects: easy without some assistance to make it work. Uh, but, but, you know, again, I, I think that when you are, when you are the king of, of the heel and you are dominating, everybody is going to scrutinize and take shots. You see legendary, uh, directors taking shots. Why? Because they can. Because they can't right.
[00:24:12] Regie Collects: And, and, you know, uh, Disney has rested on its laurels. Kevin Feige has rested on his laurels. They got lazy. They got greedy. And, uh, as a result, they, they've, they've been punched in the face. And I think that they are taking a step back and basically saying, Hey, we need to focus on quality and not quantity.
[00:24:31] Regie Collects: And potentially if they start putting out some good content, fingers crossed that people will be receptive to
[00:24:38] Badr: that. Yeah. Well, and you know what, that transitions to, um, maybe a positive side of this because, you know, it's not all gloom and doom, uh, that came out of this article. There was a little bit of some rays of sunshine.
[00:24:50] Badr: But they talk about the success of Guardians of the Galaxy 3. Like, you know, performing really well at the box office, but also being, you know, uh, you know, having some positive reception from fans and critics alike. The unfortunate part of that, though, is the guy that directs that movie, James Gunn, ends up, you know, that's his last, hurrah, that's his last movie, now he's with the Distinguished Competition, you know, so it's like, damn, alright, so the one, you know, maybe they could have finagled something having James Gunn maybe in a larger role, well, we've lost that, and it kind of boils down to the chips that they haven't played quite yet, and that is, that comes from their acquisition with, uh, you know, 21st Century Fox, those properties.
[00:25:27] Badr: Things like Deadpool, X Men, Fantastic Four, and I, I, I, I am a firm believer that... I think when we get those, especially like those latter two, the Fantastic Four and X Men, I think that will breathe a new life into the MCU. You know, I see the effort, and I commend them, you know, like the fact that they're coming off of Endgame, and to this day, I will say, I thoroughly believe the MCU should have taken a hard...
[00:25:49] Badr: One to two to three years just break, you know, let people just soak it in like hey end game That's the name end game, right? Let's just end it for a little bit. Yeah, fuck it I'm gonna go ahead and get on my soapbox Oh, if I was the MCU, I would have went ahead and dropped focus on documentaries about you know The last 10 11 years of the MCU right like really let us like appreciate what we got like to this day There is not a comprehensive Or cohesive documentary that features the stars of the show.
[00:26:18] Badr: And I don't know if they're saving it for maybe later to do some big, you know, retrospective 20 year anniversary or whatever, 30 year anniversary. But I wish they would have just taken the chance to just, you know, like appreciate what we got, you know, and celebrate the victory of like 11 years of.
[00:26:32] Badr: Consistent, you know, what, uh, 32 films, you know, this massive story, this giant feat in cinema. Like, I wish we were just taking time to just slow down, breathe, and then bring on this new crop of characters. Because I think it was just too soon, you know, like, from the pa and that's not that's discounting the pandemic and all this shit that, you know, the the emotional and mental strain that it had on all of us.
[00:26:53] Badr: I think at the time, it sounded good, like, oh man, we're gonna get more MCU content and it's gonna be on TV, I don't gotta wait for a year. But clearly they just overshot, right? Like it was over commitment. The plan was way too big considering the resources, right? Like. Kevin Feige can't check all of this, you know, the visual effects can't keep up with all of this.
[00:27:12] Badr: And then one other thing that this article goes into is just the half baked scripts. And I say that as a quotation because that was the exact phrasing one of the visual effects artists talks about. I don't think they give her credit or whatnot, but it was someone that worked on She Hulk and they talked about like, we had to do a bunch of reshoots because the suits Watch the show and realize by episode six or eight Oh wow, we're just now seeing her transform.
[00:27:36] Badr: We should probably put that in the beginning. Which cost them a bunch of time, a bunch of money. And, you know, you start, you start just seeing, like, all these cracks. You know, and, and, and it could almost be just pointed at the very basics of just like, does it have a good script? Is the foundation well? You know, no, not clearly.
[00:27:53] Badr: We're, we're fucking running before we're even crawling. And that's
[00:27:56] Ed: the thing with, you know, doing pilots and stuff. You have your own platform. Why not shoot a pilot? See how reactions it gets. You people give a shit. It's like, I like She Hulk as a character, and I think they may have. From what I've seen, the little that I've seen, it's like, they might've tried to do the John Byrne era, she Hulk kind of the fourth wall breaking, but to mainstream audiences, they're thinking this is like a Deadpool.
[00:28:20] Ed: It was just kind of like a, any, anyone that breaks the fourth wall is like a Deadpool, you know, because that's the one that most people are familiar with that aren't into comics. So it's like they had this platform and like, you know, just repeating what you guys have said, but. You have your own basically TV channel, old man terms, you know, shoot pilot, shoot an hour, you know, trying to combine to fit this bigger narrative.
[00:28:47] Ed: Like, I don't see what was, you know, I like the Netflix stuff like that was in the same universe, but it. Didn't have to mention it every five seconds. You see a kid in the DVD talking about the event. You see Easter eggs in there, but they're in their own little section of this world. The world is bigger than they make it, you know?
[00:29:04] Ed: So it's, I, I don't get, and like I said, we're playing with, they're not playing with action figures. These are real living people that want to do other stuff. They don't want to do be captain America for 30 years. You know, they want to do other things. They're artists. Like one of the last few things that I loved was my favorite thing was werewolf by night.
[00:29:24] Ed: That's probably my favorite Marvel MCU thing in a while, you know, and like I said, short, sweet, you know, you didn't really have to know the characters, you know, you basically had to be, you know, watched a few horror movies in your lifetime and it was perfect.
[00:29:39] Badr: I guess the good news is, you know, all the problems we, we've, we've listed and talked about is that they're not, uh, irreparable, right?
[00:29:49] Badr: They're not, it's not like, These things can't be fixed. Yeah, they got money. Yeah, exactly. They got plenty of money. So, the script thing, right? They can hire better writers. They can spend more time writing better scripts. The visual effects, you know, that's something that I, you know, I imagine it's way more complex, but that can be fixed.
[00:30:04] Badr: Like, a lot of these problems can be fixed, and as shitty as this, as it sounds to say this, at least they didn't have these fuck ups with, like, Big properties like X Men and Fantastic Four, you know, if you're going to take a swing and, and try some stuff and try to follow up from, you know, your, your, your amazing act that was phases one through four and end game and all of that, you know, at least it wasn't with, you know, your other blue chips that could possibly save.
[00:30:28] Badr: You know, what you got going on, because imagine if they would have came out the gate with Fantastic Four and X Men and they were plagued with these same issues, you know, Fox did that already, Fox did that already, that is right, they did have a blueprint, they did have a blueprint to follow,
[00:30:42] Regie Collects: I was waiting for my opportunity to say that,
[00:30:45] Ed: don't do this, this is our blueprint, do not
[00:30:47] Regie Collects: do this, don't do this at all, uh, you know, what I, what I will say to you is that I don't think that these things are, um, uncorrectable.
[00:30:56] Regie Collects: Right. I think that you can, you've had a little bit of a break. Let's, let's think about that, right? The writers have been on strike. The actors are still on strike. There is a break right now, literally giving, uh, potentially, um, the leadership at, at Marvel. Um, at Disney, an opportunity to, to think a little bit before they start to act.
[00:31:18] Regie Collects: The writers will have additional time. I think that the, the concerns expressed by the special effects people have been heard loud and clear and documented. And so maybe they should be given longer lead times to work on this stuff. Uh, Disney has admitted that they're going to focus on quality and not quantity.
[00:31:36] Regie Collects: Right? So I feel like they are saying the right stuff. My concern is the fandom. My concern is, will the fandom be able to recognize an improvement in quality, or will they be so jaded, so as to not even see the improvement? Where
[00:31:54] Badr: it's like, is it cool to just hate on MCU, when clearly we've got a good pro Okay,
[00:31:58] Regie Collects: I see where you're going.
[00:31:59] Regie Collects: And, and, I talk to a lot of people, I read a lot of comments. There are people that just regurgitate what they hear without thought they, they, they, they invest no time thinking, or even doing a simple Google search before it is all trash. It is all woke trash. If they come out with the X Men, that is quintessential woke ness think about, think about the X Men bro.
[00:32:25] Badr: Reggie, trust me, we've, we've definitely said
[00:32:27] Regie Collects: that. Right? So think about the X Men, even if the X Men is, is, is fantastic. It will still be seen as woke by people because it's diverse. That just right from the diversity. It's woke trash. You haven't even seen it. But now you're saying it's trash. My, my fear is the fandom and not even necessarily true comic book fans, the adjacent fandom that floods into the comment section to offer their opinion on something that they don't.
[00:33:03] Regie Collects: I had somebody just today tell me, uh, Marvel and DC are superhero companies that they've never heard of. Published anything other than superhero and I'm like, so first of all, you need to run a Google search, sir. You know, um, but, but it's that type of person that will leave the woke trash, the MCU comment, the, this is garbage, you know?
[00:33:29] Regie Collects: Uh, without really appreciating the source material to your, to your point, they've never even read a comic, but they have an opinion on what's good. For comics,
[00:33:38] Ed: but that's just kind of like a mob mentality to, you know, you're just, that's the
[00:33:42] Regie Collects: mob is going out, but it's that mob mentality to some degree that is do me a lot of stuff.
[00:33:49] Regie Collects: Captain marvel or the, the, the marvels trash hasn't even come out trash because why? They don't like Brie Larson. Yeah. They don't like Brie. Three women and Brie Larson. Yeah. One of my, one of my best watched videos as of the last 30 days was one I did on Brie Larson because people, uh, misinterpreted, misled other people on what she actually said a couple of years ago.
[00:34:18] Regie Collects: The movie, they want that movie to fail. Because Brie Larson is in it and because it's three women that are leading that movie and that's not, I don't think those are real comic fans. At least I don't, I don't think. Right. Um, but it's interesting. They
[00:34:34] Ed: said the same things too about like, you know, Black Panther having the movie can't do well because it's a primarily African American cast.
[00:34:41] Ed: So the same thing about Shang Chi. So it's yeah, that mob is unfortunately. I think always going to be there, you know,
[00:34:48] Badr: there's a lot of racist idiots out online saying
[00:34:51] Regie Collects: that the challenge is, is that the writing's not good into my, in a lot of ways, right? The writing's not as maybe it's what it was before, but then it's to the point that I made before about, um, the, the, the turnout for the movies isn't as strong.
[00:35:08] Regie Collects: So, you know, black Panther to make 853 million. But it's trash because it didn't make as much as the first one. Well, the economy is night and day between those two movies. So how can you say that? It's a different business model. Yeah. It's a different time, right? Captain Captain Marvel made 1. 1. It's trash.
[00:35:28] Regie Collects: People only saw that because of Endgame. Well, it's still made 1. 1 billion. You can't just throw it out, you know, but that's the stuff that people do.
[00:35:38] Badr: I was listening to a, uh, I was listening to a music podcast prior to this and they. I think what the issue that you're, you're mentioning about fans, um, and, and really like that mom mentality and what they deem as, you know, a success and just focusing on number, which is such a backwards way of thinking.
[00:35:54] Badr: But this particular music podcast was talking about how fans online. Will rip an artist apart if they only sell whatever 10, 000 albums and it's like damn like 10, 000. You know what I'm saying? To that is
[00:36:08] Ed: like hey mcdonald's serve over a billion burgers.
[00:36:14] Ed: Is there are they do they make the best hamburgers? I don't think so But they've served a billion of them What that numbers mean, but
[00:36:17] Regie Collects: that's the crazy thing about it is is You know, they probably, some of these people probably hadn't even heard what the artist's song was about. They probably never even listened to it.
[00:36:27] Regie Collects: They just, they saw a headline. Oh, he's a failure. He only sold 10, 000. 10, 000 is a lot. And maybe they were sold for a hundred dollars. Wasn't there a rapper that released a, some, some album charged a hundred bucks
[00:36:41] Badr: for it? There's a few artists that have done it, but I think who you're talking about is the late great Nipsey Hussle who put out a mixtape and was charging a hundred dollars.
[00:36:49] Badr: And he sold out. I think I forgot how many he sold, but it was enough to where, you know, he was, he went the indie route and, you know, it was enough to financially definitely support him on his own. But, you know, he leaned into, I think his mentality was like, if I only have a hundred fans, you know, that's who I'm catering towards.
[00:37:04] Badr: Fuck trying to get, you know, all, you know, cast a wide net and only catch two fish. Like I'm focused on building a community. He focused
[00:37:11] Regie Collects: on quality and not quantity.
[00:37:13] Badr: Which brings us to, I think, a good stopping point for, for this particular subject, which is, it sounds like, you know, Curtin has been unveiled, we see a bunch of the cracks, I'm curious what happens next, right?
[00:37:25] Badr: I don't, and also, I don't think that this article comes out just willy nilly, I want to see the time, I'm trying to figure out the pieces for the timing of it, you know, like, I've heard, like, a, a rumor about, I'm trying to maybe position this in a way to fire certain execs there and, you know, behind the scenes stuff, that's all like, you know, hearsay, but I think the timing of it is interesting and I'm curious to see what comes out of it next steps, right?
[00:37:48] Badr: Like. You've got your business all up in the public now, you know, everything that people have said about the company is coming to light. What happens next? What happens if this Jonathan Majors, I think that'll be a huge precedent going forward, right? Because if they put all their chips on one guy to be the big bad and be the face of this next chapter, what happens when he's out the way?
[00:38:07] Badr: I'm very curious to see how the MCU pivots. And if, you know, the blue chips they got in their back pocket with Fantastic Four and Deadpool 3 and X Men are enough to save. Yeah, and I say save like very like loosely, right? Like, like we've just said, this is fucking Disney and Marvel. Yeah, they don't need no saving.
[00:38:24] Badr: Like they're really just competing against themselves. But unfortunately, they're competing with like, you know, something unprecedented. Like, how do you compete against, you know, MCU, you know, phases one through three? It's, it's gonna, it's gonna have to look different. I think people's expectations need to adjust as well.
[00:38:42] Badr: So with that being said, we could definitely just do a whole episode about this one particular article, but I want to move on to our second topic for today. Reggie, this is one that you brought to the table. It sounds like this is Warner's Warner Media's response to basically like, kind of like this article in the state of Marvel's Affairs and their plan to not, you know, fall into the same trap, which in my opinion was kind of a loose plan, but I want to hear from you, man, go ahead and set us up.
[00:39:07] Badr: What is this article about? It's definitely a
[00:39:10] Regie Collects: loose plan. You know, I read the article and I was like, well, duh, at the end, it was like, well, duh. Um, but, but this is an article, uh, quoting Casey Bloyce. I think that's how you say his name. His name, he is the Damn, HBO CEO. The CEO of HBO and, uh, he was doing, uh, I guess a press event where they were talking about the 2024, uh, Max and HBO slate.
[00:39:35] Regie Collects: And as you would imagine, anytime you get in front of a reporter, they're going to ask you all types of questions, right? About. All the stuff that you were working on and I want to I want to read a couple of excerpts from this because he spoke about the fact that the plan for Max formerly HBO Max is for the that that the app to still be a hub.
[00:39:57] Regie Collects: For tentpole shows adapted or spun off from Warner Brothers movies, which includes what DC is actually doing. James Gunn and Peter Safran, huge part of that. But when he was asked about, you know, tentpoles and he was asked about hero fatigue, here's what he said. He said, I think tentpole fatigue is telling the same story over and over again.
[00:40:21] Regie Collects: I actually think that's the definition of insanity, but whatever he noted in this, in this to, to this interview that while he admired Marvel's output of movies and shows, the studio might be suffering from fatigue because there's a lot of them. And the article highlights that he didn't go into a whole lot of detail on like what HBO Max was going to be releasing for the DCU.
[00:40:45] Regie Collects: He was a little, uh, nebulous on like the timing of when these movies from D. C. were going to be coming out after Superman Legacy, and it's probably because they're still trying to figure it out. They're still making adjustments, knowing that at least the actors are still striking. So that's been a huge hindrance.
[00:41:02] Regie Collects: But he says D. C. is trying to tell different stories, different styles. To not do the same show over and over again, and he highlights that Peacemaker is a different show than Penguin says there's, there's not uniformity. And later in the interview, he says, when you let quality be your guide, I think that's a good way to balance it.
[00:41:26] Regie Collects: And again, my response to all of that is duh. He, he literally didn't offer anything that was unique in that response.
[00:41:34] Badr: Can I also note that when he draws that comparison of, you know, Peacemaker is nothing like Penguin is, we haven't seen Penguin. I mean, I believe you, but brother, we ain't seen Penguin yet.
[00:41:42] Badr: It's not even out, you know, how am I supposed to know that? But I mean,
[00:41:46] Regie Collects: I'm guessing what he's like, it's going to be gritty. It's going to be gritty. Like Batman was gritty versus Peacemaker, which was, uh, I guess, dark comedy. Right? Um, but, but again, it's, it's like, you're not offering up really anything substantive in this.
[00:42:00] Regie Collects: And, and if you take a step back from it, he's simply saying everything that Marvel has already said. We're going to focus on quality and not quantity that that's literally what Marvel is said. Um, but it's, it's interesting again, going back to the earlier conversation, because this does dovetail people have to acknowledge that the MCU was focused on making as much money as they possibly could during the pandemic to keep themselves afloat.
[00:42:28] Regie Collects: That is why they crammed and, and all these shows down the throats of the special effects people, because they were trying to make money and it backfired. Yes, they made a ton of money, but they, they hurt a lot of people, right? Hurt a lot of careers, probably ran a lot of people out of the industry, but then they also damaged their reputation and created big heel for them to climb.
[00:42:56] Regie Collects: And to your point, maybe they should have just taken a step back and be like, you know what? We just had an amazing run. Let's take a little bit of a break. But when you are pulling in billions of dollars. That's hard to be like, you know what? I think that's enough money.
[00:43:09] Ed: Plus you have like stockholders too.
[00:43:12] Ed: I'm one of
[00:43:12] Badr: them. I realize how optimistic and kind of foolish I sound, right? Like we're talking about the most capitalistic of capitalistic companies. You don't stop after 30 billion, you know? Um, but back to your DC point. Yeah, it sounds like all these things that, like, you would expect. You know, it's like, yes, it should be quality over quantity.
[00:43:32] Badr: Like, you know, these very basic things, like, uh, okay. And I, I get that maybe... Quality, eh? Tell me more about this.
[00:43:39] Regie Collects: Quality. Can you spell, can you spell that?
[00:43:43] Ed: And it's funny because, like, DC has spent, or I'm sorry, yeah, Warner Brothers has spent how many years trying to capture that same magic Marvel has? You have like eight or nine years of failure.
[00:44:00] Badr: Isn't it crazy how, you know, some shit just comes back around. I find it really funny that at the height of MCU, how, I mean, hell, on this show alone, right? We would talk about DC's failed attempts at trying to replicate, you know, the, you know, the, the combined universe and all the movies was terrible and how now with all the focus being on Marvel, you know, their failures and just, and here's the thing too, that, that article really highlighted is that this has all kind of happened in the last three years, like all of this, these challenges in these, you know, the ball being dropped just within three years we're pointing at, you know, I'm sure there's a lot more to unearth, you know, looking at holistically at the MCU.
[00:44:38] Badr: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But in the past three years, but the same thing could be the reverse could be said about Warner Brothers in DC I think they've really hit a stride lately You know considering, you know Suicide Squad Peacemaker is a Batman. Black, Black
[00:44:54] Regie Collects: Adam. Don't don't
[00:44:56] Badr: skip over those now
[00:45:00] Badr: I'm just saying in the last three years in the last couple years DC has kind of hit a stride and I think it comes from realizing, okay, clearly we can't do the interconnected universe that well, you know, we can't do their shtick. So let's focus on self contained, you know, uh, quality stories, you know, Peacemaker, you know, Peacemaker is not a good example because it literally was a, uh, a spinoff, but it's not like it's trying to tell a overarching combined universe story, you know, that was a spinoff.
[00:45:29] Badr: And I think it goes into what his plan is, where it's like, we've got these 10 pole movies. Suicide squad and now we can build off, you know, it's spin off shows off of that. It sounds like they're approaching it from less is more, you know, if people are crying out for superhero fatigue, let's not put out as much, right?
[00:45:46] Badr: Like, let's focus on tentpole movies. And maybe the occasional spinoff and really focus in on quality, like it doesn't sound like they're going to try to compete from a let's pump out five shows, five movies. Let's have like a hell. I don't even think there's a D. C. You know, timeline or lineup, right? Like, it's kind of, it is nebulous.
[00:46:03] Badr: There's like a
[00:46:04] Ed: creature commandos. It's gonna and things are gonna.
[00:46:07] Badr: So, so we know a few of the titles, but we don't know the intricate details of James Gunn's tenure or I don't think it's a
[00:46:13] Regie Collects: 10 year plan, but he's only announced like the first, like, Okay. Three years or so. And
[00:46:18] Badr: Reggie, you know what, that makes me think about what you said as far as, I think maybe you said it, correct me if I'm wrong, but like, just always...
[00:46:26] Badr: I think there's a little bit, I think there's something to be said about that nebulous nature and that mystery to it where it's like, like, we don't need to tell you everything we're doing. Let this shit be a surprise, you know, let the quality and the stuff speak for itself. I think there is something to be said about always being connected and the MCU playing like the social media game really well where, you know, every San Diego Comic Con, you know, people were looking forward to the timeline and the news, you know, it's like.
[00:46:50] Badr: We wanted to know all of these details, and I think there's something to be said about quality being tied into just, you know, a little bit of mystery.
[00:46:58] Regie Collects: I said that to somebody recently on social media, um, that if you remember back in the day, the only way for you to see your favorite celebrity or athlete or, uh, entertainer was to show up at the show, show up at the movies.
[00:47:15] Regie Collects: Right. That would show up at the game. That was your only way to see them. Now you see them on social media in their house. There's no mystery to it. You know what I'm saying? You see them waking up in the morning. Hey, I just got up. I'm about to go work out and get an ice latte. Like you, you see so much of them.
[00:47:32] Regie Collects: There's almost. Too much transparency, right? You have all of these guys that have these relationships with people in the studios that, that tell us all the details, all the Easter eggs, uh, there, there's no surprises on in anything just because there's so much information flowing to us. Potentially, they need to pull back on some of that stuff and create more mystery, create more intrigue.
[00:47:57] Regie Collects: Maybe that will hold people's interest a little bit longer, but it may be one of those things that, that to your point about being too optimistic, the cat may already be out of the bag and we can't ever go back to that. Toothpaste is out of the tube. Yeah, I mean, well, if you, if you flex the tube, right, you to get some, I mean, I've done it.
[00:48:17] Regie Collects: You, you can do it. It take a little work.
[00:48:21] Badr: Reggie. I love you, man. That was such a good rebuttal. All right. You want to talk about optimism right there? That is some awesome. I'm going
[00:48:27] Ed: to try it tonight. If it don't work,
[00:48:30] Badr: go send me a picture. I'll send you a
[00:48:33] Regie Collects: video on Instagram where you can see how you flex it.
[00:48:37] Regie Collects: And it'll, it'll pull it right back, bro. I got you. No, but it's, uh, you know, all of this stuff is interesting, man. I think that. They need to go back to the fundamentals of just tell good stories. And I don't care whether it's in the comic book, it's on the small screen or big screen. Just tell a good story.
[00:49:00] Regie Collects: Stay out of all the politics and some of the nonsense. Just tell a good story. Have some diversity of thought as well. And what I mean by that is not everything has to be a superhero. Not everything has to be somebody in spandex as much as I like spandex. Let's tell some different types of stories to attract audience.
[00:49:20] Regie Collects: Different people and also to maintain people's interest. That was one thing that Casey did say. He was basically like, we want to tell different stories. Right? And so the penguin isn't peacemaker. He's he's right. Because I'm guessing penguin probably won't be wearing a costume. He'll have on an outfit versus the spandex eagle that peacemaker wears.
[00:49:41] Regie Collects: But I think diversity of storytelling will go a long way. And both Marvel and D. C. have amazing catalogs. Dust it off and, and let's tell some good, I mean, that's why they're getting their butts kicked when it comes to comics because everything is spandex and that's why the Indies are doing so well because they're telling manga doing incredible killing it.
[00:50:03] Regie Collects: Yeah, why? Because they're telling different stories that appeal to different people is not the same story with a young version and old version, a future version. A past version, a savage version, a tame. It's like the same stuff do something different. And maybe people will continue to show up for like Oppenheimer and Barbie and super Mario brothers.
[00:50:25] Regie Collects: I haven't seen any of those movies, so I'm guessing they were all very
[00:50:30] Badr: diverse. I've seen two or three of those Mario
[00:50:32] Ed: and Oppenheimer kind of similar.
[00:50:35] Badr: Atomic, you know, I'm sure there's something to be said about Atomic Age.
[00:50:39] Regie Collects: Ed, I thought you were going to say Barbie, man. if I see you posing next to that box, brother.
[00:50:46] Badr: Ed showed up opening day all in all pink. Oh, he has some pink Air Force Ones and a pink top. All right. Actually, now, Ed, I kind of want to see you in an all pink outfit. Would you let me do that next episode? Come on. I'll wear a pink velour
[00:50:58] Ed: jumpsuit for you. Try something
[00:50:59] Badr: different. Try something different.
[00:51:00] Badr: Juicy, juicy. All right. I think that puts a pin on that one. Let's, uh, let's go to some good news with an actual plan that DC had announced that had some actual details and a solid plan, uh, Ed, you want to talk about this, this new line of compact comics that they hope to bring new readers, uh, into bookstores and et cetera.
[00:51:20] Badr: I care
[00:51:20] Ed: to talk. Yeah, this is a great idea. DC is coming out with DC compact comics are basically, I think, launching 10 titles of their, some of their top graphic novels, shrinking them down to close to The manga book size, and they're, they're wanting to put them in all, you know, big box stores, what they call transit stores, like airport gift shops, things like that.
[00:51:42] Ed: And keeping it like at 10 bucks, like I said, they want to get new non existent readers. They actually in bookstores, they want to kind of remove themselves from the comic book manga section and put them in like thriller, sci fi, you know, whatever category you want to put them in. And the only thing that I'm kind of hoping is that I I'm hoping they let.
[00:52:04] Ed: You know, comic stores get these as well, have access to these because when I worked at the comic store, that's a, that's a great sell. You know? Yeah. I've heard about this watchman. Um, oh yeah, we have this a 50 artist, uh, edition, uh, this 30, um, hardcover and this, you know, you know, 25 paper. Damn. Can I dip my toe in the pool?
[00:52:24] Ed: It's like, geez. Oh, okay. But 10 bucks, you know, like I said, image has been doing that with a lot of their first trades. Um, they actually. The. They do the first issue, the buck first issue thing, but this is a cool idea because we're getting it out to different, and it's a good mix. Like some of the titles, like I said, Watchmen, all star Superman, Batman court of owls, far sector, which is a really cool pick.
[00:52:47] Ed: It's a very, you know, contemporary pick wonder woman earth one, which is a strange one, in my opinion. American Vampire, Batman Hush, Harley Quinn, Gotham City Sirens, and Darwin Cook's Catwoman and, uh, Darwin Cook and Ed Brubaker's Catwoman Trial of the Catwoman. So, pretty cool wave, first wave of books to come out.
[00:53:10] Ed: And like I said, it's, uh, it's slightly bigger than the manga size. So it's even easy to read. Some of those big ass books are hard to read. Like I said, I think this is a really good idea to kind of broaden your readership and have access to. You know, hopefully get new fans or in the comics, like I said, keep this, keep this industry alive.
[00:53:29] Badr: I think the only thing I, first of all, thank you for, for recapping that, Ed, I, I think my only remark on the maybe more pessimistic side is that we won't see these until like June of next year. I kind of wish they would have had these out, like maybe a little sooner, um, because, you know, this is like one of the, you know, being a 24 hour news cycle, this is something that, you know, definitely be forgotten by June next year, but it is.
[00:53:52] Badr: If I understand it correctly, comic shops can order these, but they're really taking that push, like you said, to like, you know, your big box stores, your bookstores, um, the Target being one of them, and it's funny you brought up Target, because I recently bought a last Ronin hardcover from Target, because it was way cheaper than buying it off Amazon.
[00:54:10] Badr: I saw
[00:54:11] Ed: a Junji Ito coloring book at Target. What? I about lost my mind, like, what is this doing in here? This isn't for kids.
[00:54:19] Badr: That's very interesting. Reggie, do you think this will be enough to, uh, uh, you know, bring in a new crop of readers and bring in some fresh blood when it comes into, uh, you know, just comic book fans and making new readers out of them?
[00:54:34] Badr: Oh, wow. No.
[00:54:35] Regie Collects: Huh. I think, I think this is, and I'm, I'm super optimistic, but I think that this is a miss. Okay. This is a great opportunity that they potentially will fumble on. And here's why. This thing, this, they are trying to compete with manga, right? Lower price point, bang for buck in terms of page count.
[00:55:00] Regie Collects: Um, it is the, a low onboarding point, right? Because it's a self contained story, right? So they're, they're doing some of the right stuff. Manga kicks comics tail because of the scope of the stories that are being told. Ten superhero stories, essentially. Different genres. Where is the sci fi? Where is the horror?
[00:55:23] Regie Collects: Where is the action? Where is the western? Where is the romance? If you want to attract new readers, offer up some different content beyond spandex. Like all three topics we've hit on tonight. I I've already connected all of them because they're all very much connected. I think that what DC is attempting to do is, is unique.
[00:55:43] Regie Collects: It is different, but they didn't go far enough. They're not diversifying the content. If you want to attract new readers, give them something other than spandex. Look at what the Indies are doing. They have comics about firemen, and police officers, and detectives, and I mean, it's all of these different stories that are being told that have nothing to do with capes and cows.
[00:56:11] Regie Collects: I think that DC has to look at this, and I think that that's the miss.
[00:56:16] Badr: If I could play devil's advocate, what would you add to that lineup? Because I mean, isn't it? Cause I look at this list and I see like American vampire. I think that kind of fits into your horror. Is that spandex?
[00:56:28] Regie Collects: That's it. Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, hush.
[00:56:31] Regie Collects: How many times can you reprint hush? It's the same meat in a different rapper. Which
[00:56:38] Badr: one? So what would you add to this lineup? That would diversify.
[00:56:41] Regie Collects: Which one of those appeals to women? 24 percent of readers, comic book readers, are women. Where's the romance? Where's the little girl comic that might appeal to a little kid?
[00:56:54] Regie Collects: Right? I won't let my boy read Hush. I can tell you that. Right? Even to a little boy. Right? Where, where is the diverse of what, where is like the, the sci fi just straight up Buck Rogers types of, not Buck Rogers, but you know what I mean? Like something like that, something different. I think Far
[00:57:15] Ed: Sector does, but I see what you're saying.
[00:57:17] Ed: Uh,
[00:57:17] Regie Collects: what is, what is the James Tyen, uh, the James Tyen book that's
[00:57:21] Badr: super popular? He's got a few. Uh, Nice House on the Lake. Nice House on a
[00:57:26] Regie Collects: Lake. Great story. Give us that. Watchmen is a, Watchmen is a little different, but it's still capes, right? Where, where is the non superhero content? If you go back in time and you look at what Marvel and DC used to put out, they used to put out a ton of romance comics, monster comics, Godzilla stuff, right?
[00:57:52] Regie Collects: Tarzan. I mean, you name it. It's become... Nothing more than superheroes. At one point, I think that 70%, 74 percent of the books that DC released feature Batman in a month. 74 percent of them. There's no diversity there. It's all Batman. At what point do you stop riding the coattails of Batman, Superman, Spider Man, Wolverine?
[00:58:20] Regie Collects: Right? If you want new readers, give them something new and different, and maybe you will get them to come in and check out what you have to
[00:58:30] Badr: offer. I agree to a certain point, but I also think that this is their bread and butter, right? Like, you bring up Marvel and DC having produced, you know, all those genres, but it wasn't really until they hit the superhero stride that they really made a name for themselves.
[00:58:46] Badr: Now, I, I do agree, there is room, especially if we're talking DC and we're talking like other non superhero stuff, it is surprising that they haven't tapped into any of like the Vertigo stuff. Especially if their goal is to attract, you know, more mature, maybe, you know, readers that might be swayed away from, you know, Spandex.
[00:59:06] Badr: I think there is definitely room for more of that. But at the same time, I don't, I don't front them for reusing Watchmen or Batman, you know, it's like, These are considered the classics and, you know, uh, the, the icons and The classics
[00:59:17] Regie Collects: for whom? The classics
[00:59:19] Badr: for whom? But you would hope, you would hope that the classic for a comic fan would also translate to regular Comic fans are
[00:59:24] Regie Collects: already going to comic shops.
[00:59:27] Regie Collects: Comic fans have already read Hush. They've already read these stories. They probably have masterpieces of them, individual issues of them. If you're trying to attract new readers, then stop publishing the same stuff that we've all bought repeatedly in different
[00:59:43] Badr: formats. But they're not targeting us though.
[00:59:46] Badr: So if we're targeting new readers, maybe they haven't read Hush or Watchmen. And
[00:59:49] Ed: this is like the first wave too. So they're kind of... Is it?
[00:59:52] Regie Collects: Is it the first wave? Because I haven't read that they were going to diversify any of the content.
[00:59:57] Badr: I do agree, there's room for improvement and diversity in this line.
[01:00:01] Badr: But at the same time, I do think that there is, the little bit of diversity that I see in this. Is a good start. And if there is more, uh, more releases to be had, I think that'll be the true test. I understand
[01:00:13] Regie Collects: it now. They should say it now. They should say, we are starting with these, but we are going to diversify.
[01:00:18] Regie Collects: Cause Jim, if you remember Jim Lee went all about diversity, right? Diversity of creators, diversity of content. Where is it? We don't see it. It's still the same stuff being told do something different because let's, let's do this, let's play it out. Let's say that they release this stuff, and it doesn't sell.
[01:00:38] Regie Collects: Well, why didn't it sell? Y Y You've only had one test. There's no B. Why not have a B? There's no chances being taken at Marvel and DC right now. There's no stakes. There's nothing at risk.
[01:00:52] Ed: I agree with what you're saying, but I don't think you're going to find that in this corporate comic world.
[01:00:57] Badr: I think if image had taken this idea, that would be very interesting to see.
[01:01:02] Ed: They do stuff like that with their dollar first issues. And, but as far as going into like target and stuff, yeah.
[01:01:08] Badr: That's not to say that DC couldn't. Also do this, right? Like Vertigo has so much that they could offer that would kind of fit in that diverse. And I
[01:01:15] Ed: do agree with your, the Batman fatigue because like I said, black label was the, I guess, supposed, you know,
[01:01:25] Badr: like Vertigo
[01:01:26] Ed: 2.
[01:01:26] Ed: 0. Yeah, but it ends up becoming a Batman label. There's most of their titles have been Batman stories. And what was the most exciting thing about that?
[01:01:34] Regie Collects: Bat. Wayne . Yeah. And Lee bmo, uh, or lead the artist. His cover art is amazing. He's a great artist. Bjo? Bermejo. Yeah. Bermejo. Yeah. But, but when was the last time legitimately when a comic fan was actually excited about something that Marvel or DC were doing?
[01:01:51] Regie Collects: Legitimate. It's been a while.
[01:01:55] Badr: I think because I'm on the spot right now, but if I was just to pick one, you know, just quickly off the bat, Daniel Warren Johnson's Wonder Woman Dead Earth, which was a black label story, felt like a very unique take, like, granted, yes, it was telling a Wonder Woman story, but that one felt like they gave him creative liberty to tell his own story.
[01:02:14] Badr: When did that come out? Two years ago? Two years ago? Two or three years ago? So it's been
[01:02:18] Regie Collects: two years since you were excited about something?
[01:02:20] Badr: No, no, I mean, come on. I
[01:02:22] Regie Collects: know, but that was the question, right? When was the last time you were really excited about something you cited a story from two
[01:02:27] Ed: years ago?
[01:02:28] Ed: Marvel or DC or just comics in general? Pick one, bro! You
[01:02:31] Regie Collects: know what I mean? Pick one! Pick one!
[01:02:35] Ed: Transformers. I was excited about that's not what DC is. Oh, I thought you said. I just asked that he said everything. Okay. Marvel. Well, I'm not a, I'm the,
[01:02:46] Badr: yeah, Reggie. You're kind of talking to two people that have slowly swayed away from having a Marvel DC on there.
[01:02:51] Badr: But he's,
[01:02:51] Regie Collects: but why, why have you swayed away from it? Because I, cause
[01:02:55] Badr: I grew up with it, right? Like to a certain point, Oh my God. It becomes like, what else can I get from this? Like now, I follow writers and artists. So Jonathan Hickman, for example, did bring me back to Marvel recently. I was really excited for his, uh, you know, the, the, the relaunch of the Ultimate Universe.
[01:03:12] Badr: But Reggie, to your point, yes, uh, if I'm being, speaking honestly and truthfully, if you look at my pull list, it is primarily image, right? Like news stories. Different things, but occasionally I will go kind of peek my head back in my tastes
[01:03:24] Ed: have kind of gotten odd over the years, or since I was a kid, I should say, so I got heavy metal way too young.
[01:03:30] Ed: Um, um, but as far as like, you know, DC and Marvel stuff, it has to be something where it's an artist slash writer. That I'm following like the, um, Raphael grandpa's, uh, uh, Batman gargoyle of Gotham. I was stoked to see that it is beautiful comic, but I, I understand what you're saying, but with like, I'm not a, I guess I'm the, I don't know if I'm the right person to ask cause I'm usually.
[01:03:56] Ed: In the
[01:03:57] Regie Collects: IDW image, you know, I do a show every single week on the channel and I talk to people and I'm like, well, what are you reading? What are you buying? What are you most excited about? A lot of people will buy Marvel in DC because they grew up with it and that's just what they do. Right. But when they cite what they're reading, what they're excited about, it's not marvel and DC.
[01:04:20] Regie Collects: And if, and if, if, if DC is going to take a step to compete against manga, because that's what they are doing with this move, right? Manga is mentioned several times. One of the major things that they are missing is diversity of content. If you are going to take down the king, because manga is the king, diversity of content is how you're going to attract new readers, not regurgitation of the same stories that you've been printing for the last 10 and 20 and 30
[01:04:48] Badr: years.
[01:04:50] Badr: That's a fair enough point. And if I may add, Chip Zdarsky Daredevil. That has been the last one that I've been super excited, which by the way ended just like I think last month, by the way, so that's a recent one. Take that, Reggie.
[01:05:06] Badr: It's been a while. I think because it's been a while since I've had like C on one of these episodes, so I haven't had much of like that pushback, but Reggie, that was a healthy little debate back and forth, man. I appreciate that. No, well, well done. All right, Ed, very good topic, Reggie, very good, uh, very good conversation going on.
[01:05:22] Badr: I am curious to see if, you know what, to your point, I don't see anything on here talking about future releases. So I'm curious to see if, if this will have some legs to it, you know, I, I get having, you know, Watchmen and Batman hush in that initial release. That's just kind of like where they go to, I think for any diehard comic fan, you see those, you're like, all right, yeah, yeah, next, yeah, yeah, you know, it's almost like, you know, uh, it's almost to be expected, but to your point, I will concede that.
[01:05:47] Badr: They have the ability to tell diverse stories, and maybe they're saving it for a second launch. We'll see. Alright, with that being said, that is the last topic that we've got lined up for this first segment. This is where I look to our listeners and ask them to chime into the conversation. If you're still here with us and if you're still listening and you've got an opinion to share, if you've got, uh, if you agree with something we said, maybe you disagree or just, or you just want to add to, uh, the conversation just in general, uh, let us know.
[01:06:17] Badr: We'd love to hear from our listeners, especially when it comes to topics like these. So if you got something to say. You want to get it off your chest and have it on the podcast. Feel free to write us a short email at the short box, jacks at GMO. com. Or you can send us a DM on Instagram and Twitter. We would love to hear from you, uh, regarding any of the topics we share today.
[01:06:37] Badr: Now, normally this is the part where we turn the corner and we do our. segment is where we talk about, you know, the new comic books coming out in a month or so, the ones that you should be reading, the one that you should be, you know, pre ordering. Uh, and normally we, we have our good friend, Ben Kingsbury, the owner of Jacksonville's premier comic shop, Gotham city limit, uh, help us out with that.
[01:07:00] Badr: But you know what, it's been a busy week for him at the shop and he didn't have time to get his picks in, but he had. News of his own to share. All right. Ben had breaking news that he wanted us to share on this podcast. And that piece of news is that there is an opportunity for listeners to be a part to own a part of Jacksonville comic history, a piece of Gotham city limit history, uh, with the second print run.
[01:07:25] Badr: Of TMNT, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Last Ronin, number one. The Gotham City Limit exclusive variant for issue one is going back, or is coming back for a second printing. Just some context if maybe you missed out a few years ago. Um, back in October, I want to say 2020, issue one of TMNT Last Ronin, uh, came out.
[01:07:47] Badr: And Gotham City Limit was given an incredible opportunity to have their own custom Shop exclusive variant cover Tyler Kirkham did the artwork for that. It turned out awesome. I want to say that first print run, uh, sold out. So here's your opportunity to own a piece of Jacksonville and in Gotham city limit, uh, history.
[01:08:09] Badr: They're doing a second print run of that infamous cover. It'll come out actually the same day that this podcast comes out Wednesday, November 8th, it'll be available to purchase, uh, in the shop. As well as online. So even if you don't live in J you can still take your comic shopping experience. It'll limit by going to gotham city limit.com.
[01:08:28] Badr: You can purchase the, the comic from there. I believe it's $15 online, uh, but it's only limited to 400, so I imagine those will go pretty quick. Once again, you can purchase it in store at Gotham City Limit here in Jacksonville on Southside Boulevard. Or you can buy it [email protected]. Limited to 400.
[01:08:48] Badr: You don't want to miss out, especially if you missed out on the first print run. Usually second printings sometimes go for more than the, uh, first printing. I know because I've got a few second printings that I'm just holding on to the hopes I'll be able to retire one day. So who knows? Maybe this shop exclusive will be worth much more in the future, but you won't know unless you pick up a copy.
[01:09:08] Badr: So big shout outs to Ben. I'm sure we'll hear from him sooner than later. And in lieu of a Fistful of Comics segment, this actually gives us an opportunity to catch up on listener emails and fan mail. It's been a while since we got to read some emails and hear from listeners. You guys know I love hearing from the listeners.
[01:09:24] Badr: I love when you guys get involved. And fortunately for us, we got two emails to read today. And our first email comes from a longtime friend of this show. I mean, this is a guy that I've known for a long time. Ed, I know you've got some history with him as well. But he's a longtime supporter of the show.
[01:09:40] Badr: His name is Chad Landenberger, and he sent in an email this week that I want to read. He writes in, he wrote, uh, Hey, short boxers. I'd like to start by saying I've listened to your Daniel Warren Johnson interview twice already. Great job and congrats. I've been a fan of his since Murder Falcon, and he's an artist I get excited telling non comic book fans about.
[01:10:00] Badr: Additionally, I'd like to champion Scavenger's Reign on Max, an adult animated sci fi series by Titmouse. It's about space truckers stranded on an alien planet who go through these weird and convoluted ways of using the local fauna. I get bits of Cronenberg, Mobius, and Annihilation. There are just a few episodes out, and so far it's my vote for the best animated series of the year.
[01:10:23] Badr: Love y'all, keep up the great work. Big shout out to Chad, that was a good, good email. Um, have any of you watched this, uh, Scavenger's Reign show? I have to look into it. No, not me. I mean, he kind of sold me on this Cronenberg, Mobius and Annihilation, uh, mix right there. Especially with Mobius. And he's not, I feel like Mobius, if I hear the word Mobius, it's like XYZ and Mobius.
[01:10:42] Badr: I'm in. Check that out. Thank you, Chad. All right. Our next email comes from a friend of the show we haven't heard from in a minute. All right. Captain Bruce Squid. You remember that name, Ed? Is that
[01:10:53] Ed: the, yeah.
[01:10:55] Badr: That was the most, like, that was unbelievable. That's the Australian guy? Or no? No, no, that's not the Australian guy.
[01:11:00] Badr: That's Matt Godwin you're thinking of. Okay. Uh, Captain Bruce Squid. Sure. Is Chris James. Good friend of mine. Yeah. Alright. This email comes from Captain Bruce Squid. Alright, we have to hear from him in a minute. He wrote, uh, Yo, what up short box? It's been a while. Too long at that. First off, I want to thank you for the Patreon box that you sent out a while ago.
[01:11:20] Badr: You can tell the books were picked with care and they were right up my alley. I've been radio silent for the last few months. Been a lot of ups and downs. Messed up my back at work and wasn't able to drive my, to drive, which is my job. My future was up in the air. I unsubscribed to a bunch of things because I had no idea how long I was going to be out.
[01:11:37] Badr: Well, after two months of physical therapy, your boy is back. The books you sent and a lot of YouTube helped me make, helped me make it through. I'm back on the road and I'm good. Wife and children are good. So I got a few extra bucks I can spare a month if you catch my drift. Anyway, I look forward to keeping in touch as always.
[01:11:53] Badr: Thanks for all that you guys do. Chris Jenks, a. k. a. Bruce Squid. Nice. Chris, I don't know if you wanted me to read all of that, that sounded like a lot of TMI. But look, I'm, I'm very excited that, you know, you got healed up, that life is looking good. Yo, and uh, he just joined the Patreon back again. Nice. So welcome back to the Patreon.
[01:12:11] Badr: Yeah, I'm
[01:12:12] Ed: glad he's
[01:12:12] Regie Collects: doing better. Hell yeah. Backs are tricky. You, you mess up your back, it makes everything miserable. You can't sit, you can't
[01:12:20] Badr: lay. Yeah, C was out for like two months. Oh yeah, I remember that. When he got his back surgery. Yeah, that is no joke. So Chris, I'm glad to hear the recovery went well.
[01:12:28] Badr: And real quick, speaking of Patreon and patrons and whatnot, we did get a new patron that joined this month, or last month. Let's go and get a round of applause ready for our newest Patreon member, a new, the newest member of the Patreon community, a guy, Justin McCoy. Welcome, Justin. You know, interesting story about Justin.
[01:12:49] Badr: Justin goes to the same barbershop that I go to. I think he gets his hair cut by the same guy as well. Ended up learning that he's into comic books. I think, you know, I was in the shop, my barber was asking me about the podcast, he overheard it, you know, he was like, Oh, check it out. And you know, you hear that a lot.
[01:13:04] Badr: Oh, check it out. I'll check it out. Never happens. He's gonna forget about this the minute he walks out this door. Not at all. Every time I see him at the shop now, which is, you know, one of those things where it's like, once you see someone, now you see them everywhere. I see him at Gotham City Limit all the time.
[01:13:18] Badr: Super cool, and it's awesome to see him come on as a supporter of the Patreon. So welcome to the Patreon, uh, Justin, and, you know, big shoutouts to you. Uh, Reggie, I do got one question for you, man, and, and that's like, what do you got going on? Cause I, like I mentioned in the intro, which feels like a long time, you know, a while ago.
[01:13:37] Badr: You are a multi talented guy, you've got, you've run the YouTube, you've run an awesome Instagram, like I said, you cover, if we're being honest, you've pretty much touched on all of these topics this week as they come out, and I think that's the power of doing like short, uh, short content, bite sized content, you could be quick, you're agile, um, and, you know, you're just as, you're just as well spoken and, you know, just as good, giving your opinions on the short form as you are long content, but that's not the only thing you do, I know that you also, uh, you're a comic writer yourself, Uh, you actually have a, you're a published author.
[01:14:09] Badr: Like what else is going on in your world? Uh, I like to stay
[01:14:13] Regie Collects: busy, brother. So, uh, just off the top, uh, husband and father is probably the biggest things that I do, right? A couple of kids and a wife and a career. The comic stuff is, is what I do for fun, um, just because I absolutely enjoy it. And to your point, I have a YouTube channel called Reggie Collects, um, and as part of putting out, uh, several, uh, videos, long form videos and live streams per week.
[01:14:39] Regie Collects: We also do short form content, as you mentioned, on Instagram and also on YouTube. Uh, but then, yeah, we, we've put out a couple of guides, the guide to smart comic collecting, we did, uh, the first one on the tail end of the pandemic and, you know, the two guides that are really designed to help people be smarter about the hobby of comic book collecting, uh, and that success of that we sold 4200 copies of the very first volume that we put out.
[01:15:07] Regie Collects: Um, that led me to start putting out my own con, uh, comics. So I've put together a team of some great writers, uh, some great creators from the Kubrick school, and we've been self publishing a couple of comics. And um, we have four issues of one called isolation that has been written by a guy by the name of Doug, Doug Bratton, extremely talented guy.
[01:15:33] Regie Collects: And then we released our second title, Marcus at New York comic con written by a guy by the name of Scott, just talented people that I have a chance to, uh, to work with. I can't draw to save my life, uh, but I do have the ability to find some really talented writers and, and to hire some really talented artists to put out this content.
[01:15:53] Regie Collects: And we've, we've had some, some decent success, right? We, with isolation specifically, we've printed and sold more than 10, 000 copies. Uh, of isolation, which is a lot for me to, to sell them, to edit them, to ship, personally ship them all that. That's a lot for me. Uh, but it's all just, it's fun stuff, man. Um, so we, well, in terms of what we have coming up, a lot of content coming out on YouTube and Instagram every single week that that's
[01:16:23] Badr: the plan.
[01:16:24] Badr: Hell yeah. Reggie, look, I respect the hustle and I respect the quality and care and attention that you put into your content. And I want to thank you so much for hopping on with us, man. Like here, having your opinion in your voice. Was excellent. So I'm gonna have links to you know, your YouTube. I'm links to your Instagram in these show notes I highly encourage our listeners to check out what you got going on become a fan become a subscriber become a supporter Listeners me and Ed are gonna stay on for a little longer.
[01:16:48] Badr: We're gonna hop over on the patreon talk about some of the other Headlines we didn't have a chance to get to as well as do our own Champion season, uh, spotlight. But besides that, there you have it. Shortbox nation. That is our show for today. We really appreciate you spending your time with us. If you're not a member of our Patreon community yet, what are you waiting for?
[01:17:08] Badr: Come on. Here is your sign. Here's your sign. Join us over at patreon. com slash the short box. Not only will you get access to bonus content, extra episodes and free comics, but you'll also be supporting the show and helping us keep this thing going. Come be a part of the Patreon community at patreon. com slash short box.
[01:17:25] Badr: There'll be a link for that in the show notes. And if you don't want to pay a few bucks for bonus episodes, yo, all good, like we've been talking about, this economy is pretty funky, alright, it's tough times out there, completely get it. I just ask for one small favor, if you enjoyed this episode, leave us a 5 star rating and review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or better yet, tell a friend, alright, or tell your favorite comic nerd about this show, to have them subscribe, because word of mouth and ratings really help us out, alright, I think Reggie will go ahead and tell you, Those small things don't cost you nothing, but they mean a lot to us.
[01:17:56] Badr: So leave a review. If you haven't tell a friend and most importantly, take care of yourselves. Go read your comics and continue to make mine and your short box. I'll catch you next week. Peace.
