An Interview with Chris Ryall about Syzergy, Marvel History, and The Mighty Marvel Calendar Book - The Short Box Podcast Ep. 441
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in this episode of The Short Box. Unlike most calendars, which were always just like sort of a generic piece of art and then a white grid of squares, you know, that may be listed, I don't know, a couple of holidays or like daylight savings time and stuff like that, like Marvel treated every bit of the calendar, like cover to cover as a piece of art in the way they treated their comics the same way. And so I wanted to do a book based on these because I never saw them reprinted. I'm like, there's a ton of great art in there. Like...
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Bill Sinkovich and Jack Kirby and John Byrne and like Frank Miller and George Perez, like on and on and on all these great artists. A murderer's row of the all time greats, like, you know, like Mount Rushmore galore. Yeah, and so it's always like, well, why have the world not seen these things? Why are they not reissued or somehow collected?
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intro music plays
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Yo, Short Box Nation! Hello again, welcome back and thanks for pressing play today. If you're new, welcome to the show. My name is Badr and this is the Short Box Podcast, the comic book talk show that brings you the best conversations about your favorite comics with the people that put their blood, sweat and tears into making them. This is episode 441 and this show is made possible by two amazing benefactors. The first being the Short Box Elite, aka the fans and supporters who make up our humble but mighty
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You can also get some free comics and short box merch sent to you. One more time for the folks in the back. That's patreon.com slash the short box. And last but not least, this podcast is also powered by Gotham city limit. Our official sponsors in Jacksonville's premier location for comic books, collectibles, toys, and more. If you live in Jacksonville or if you ever find yourself passing through Jacksonville, Florida, go visit the shop for yourself on Southside Boulevard. It's right next to Tencel town movie theater. Go to Gotham city limit.
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and told him that bought her from the short black sent you. And I guarantee someone's gonna hook you up with some killer deals on comics and merch. Bonus points if Ben Kingsbury is working there, the owner. He'll definitely hook you up and he'll know what I'm talking about. Big shout out to Gotham City Limit. Now that aside, today's show, I'm joined by maybe the most accomplished person in comics that I probably have ever had on the podcast. His name is Chris Ryle and he's best known for being the former president, publisher, chief creative officer.
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and editor-in-chief of IDW Publishing from June 2004 to 2019. That's about 15 years of that 20-plus year career at one of the most premier comic publishers, just top dog in all aspects. During his tenure at IDW, he helped develop hundreds of original properties as both editor and writer, and he helped form important partnerships between IDW and some really high-profile licensors, such as Hasbro, Nickelodeon, Lucasfilm,
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and a whole bunch more. He also worked with creators Joe Hill, who was a short box alumni. He was on the show last year and actually spoke very highly about Chris. But Chris has worked with creators Joe Hill and Gabriel Rodriguez in the development of Lock and Key, serving as the editor on the comic series and as an executive producer on all three seasons on the Netflix adaptation.
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He's also a well-respected and award-winning writer himself. In January, 2022, he teamed up with the acclaimed comic creator, Ashley Wood, to start the Scissor G publishing line, which is an imprint of Image Comics. Chris is the writer and co-creator of Scissor G titles such as Zombies vs. Robots, Onyx, The Hollows, and Tales of Suspense. Ooh, a lot of going on here. He's on the podcast today to talk about his new book, The Mighty Marvel Calendar Book, Visual History. It's a stunning.
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272 page hardcover book that collects and brings together the full set of Marvel calendars, which were originally published from 1975 to 1981. And it's collected here for the first time in this deluxe oversized edition. If you're a diehard Marvel Comics fan or an aspiring or amateur Marvel historian like myself, this is a must have for you. And the holidays are right around the corner. So this is an easy stocking stuff for a Christmas gift, whatever it may be, to go ahead and put on your list.
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The Mighty Marvel Calendar book is available anywhere you get your books and at local comic shops. I know where I'm picking mine up at, at Gotham City Limits. It should be, actually it should be in the shop right now as I'm recording, by the time this episode comes out. And with all that said, that's what we're getting into today, all right? We're talking about a long tenure at IDW. We're talking about this Mighty Marvel Calendar book and anything else that we find ourselves into. So without further ado, Shorebox Nation, let's welcome Chris Ryle to the show. Whoa. Man, what an intro. I don't know that there's a-
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Chris, no, we gotta let the applause play for you, buddy. Sorry, I had that on, dude. Chris, welcome to the show. How are you doing today? Man, I'm doing great. I don't know that there's anything more to say. That intro was perfect on its own. Thank you for that. I'm like, Chris, have a good night. Thank you for coming through. Awesome interview. Yeah, you summed it up perfectly. That was great, thanks. We covered everything. Chris, I guess my first question to you is, I actually know what, before I even dive in, how are you doing today? I know it's been a crazy week.
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to say the very least, this week. We're recording on a very interesting week of all weeks. How are you doing? Yeah, thank you for asking. I mean, I'm probably, I don't know, I don't know how, how is anybody doing right now? Like, there's a certain segment that is celebrating this week, but the rest of us are kind of spending the week wallowing in just the, you know, we don't want to get political here, but I'm wallowing in the fact that
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We just made another terrible self-defeating decision that is just going to lead to so many unintended and intended awful things for a lot of groups of people that I just don't know how we're still here. So how I'm doing is trying to keep my head in comics and old comics and just stuff that makes me feel good and be around people like you and other people in the comic industry that are inventive and creative and empathetic. So all of that is how I'm trying to...
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feel good about what we're doing and where we're headed. So if that's any answer. I think that sums it up perfectly. I was definitely been in my head this week. But you know what has made me happy and excited is preparing for this interview and going down the rabbit hole that is your career. And my first question for you is, what's harder, being a comic writer, an editor in chief, a publisher, a chief creative officer?
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or an executive producer on a Netflix show. What's harder? Do you have a personal favorite role that you've had throughout your career? Well, so it's funny, like the easiest thing, but also the least paying as an unpaid thing was the editor-in-chief role on the Lock and Key series. So there were executive producers who were sort of hands-on and on set every day and sort of doing all the things that, well, some executive producers do. And I was more of a...
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credit than I was anything else. I was reading through the scripts and offering bits of feedback here and there. It was not a challenging thing. It was mostly just trying to ensure whatever level of consistency and adherence to the rules and the universe that was set up in the comic series, in the TV show. I understand they didn't need to make it their own thing, but just trying to be that connective tissue between the comic and the TV show. I think the hardest part of the different roles I've had was...
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publisher because that kind of pulls you the farthest away from the actual parts of the job that I like, which is developing books and working with creators on books and figuring out the direction of titles that we're publishing and figuring out what we're going to do next or what the publishing line is going to consist of. Whereas the publisher role is kind of a more nuts and bolts like, all right, well, how do we maximize these opportunities? How do we sell these books in the most markets? How do we find ways to get the books into people's hands? But it kind of removes you from...
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the creator process, which is I think where I sort of do my best work and also where I enjoy being the most. In layman's term, how would you describe the difference in roles between an editor-in-chief versus a publisher versus a CCO in terms of like a comic company? I work for a marketing department, so I'm familiar with like what our CCO does, our chief creative officer. I'm curious like if there's any overlap with for a comic publisher.
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Yeah, no, it's a great question because it is. It's very different. Even probably from publisher to publisher is very different. I'm sure C.B. Cebulski as Marvel's editor-in-chief has a different scope of responsibilities than I had as editor-in-chief at IDW. But effectively, so when I started there in 2004, I started as the editor-in-chief, but I was also the only editor on staff. And so I was sort of doing all parts of things. I was working with the writers on the scripts and I was working with the artists and...
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getting the art in, moving it to an anchor or a color, to a letter. You're sort of more in the trenches when you're the editor-in-chief. At least I was more hands-on on the direct making of the comics. Sort of going up from there, the chief creative officer is more of a bigger picture focus on the broader publishing line. Here's what we're doing for this year. What's our next three years look like? What do we want to be publishing? Who do we want to be in business with?
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what partnerships we want to form with places like you mentioned, like Hasbro and Lucasfilm and Marvel and others. And so you're kind of building and maintaining those relationships and figuring out at a higher level, like what that publishing line is going to look like with each of them. And so it's more of the 30,000 foot view of the publishing line. And then the publisher is sort of doing bits of that, but also having a more direct role in figuring out
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Like what are the best ways to elevate these books once we've made them? How do we get them into the world? What is our presence? I don't know, at conventions and sort of the foreign sales and digital and all of those kind of distribution ends of things on top of the publishing line itself. So again, it kind of gets you away from the working directly with creators and the making of stuff and more of like the pushing that stuff once it's made out into the world. Wow. Okay.
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I guess staying on the topic of the different hats that you've worn throughout your career, according to your Wiki, you have a lot of firsts. The amount of first time, etc. that I could find was really impressive. That's why I said earlier on, you're one of the most accomplished folks I've had on the show. I want to list off some of these firsts and then I want to ask you a question about it. This comes from your Wikipedia on top of some other things I found.
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Chief Creative Officer, that was 2010. You were an editor in chief for Kevin Smith's very early website, early 2000s, moviepoopshoot.com, which is so funny as hell to say, which was his first, technically it's not like a first first, but it was Kevin Smith's first foray outside of like just doing movies and films. So you got that to your credit. Yeah, and that one was like, it started for him as a goof. Like it was a parody site in one of his movies and James Silemops strikes back. So he wanted me to basically take that
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because it was an established name within the movie, he wanted me to turn it into like a legitimate pop culture portal with comic movie, TV, music news, all in one place. You're sort of handcuffed by the name to some degree. So, it took some work to sort of make people realize we were legitimate. Yeah, totally. You're in a room at a roundtable with actors and whatnot and there's somebody from Variety, there's somebody from, I don't know, Ain't It Cool News, and somebody from Hollywood Reporter.
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I'm from movie Poop Shoot and everybody kind of raises their eyebrow and goes, well, how'd he get in the room? So, it took a little bit of time to establish ourselves as a legitimate thing and not the site that it was in the movie, which was just like a shit talking parody site. So yeah, it was a good, like it was fun. I get, certainly that's Kevin Smith's brand. And so it was a good learning experience on how to present ourselves in ways that get us taken seriously despite that name.
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No, like moviepoopshoot.com, you can hang your hat on that. All right, that's a strong CV bullet point right there for the resume. All right, so you got that. Among the other list of firsts that you got, you co-wrote with Simon Furman, who I had on the show just last week. He was last episode's guest of honor. So it was a kind of cool full circle moment. But you co-wrote with Simon Furman, the first Transformers film prequel. It says here that during your tenure at IDW, the publisher was made a premier publisher.
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won their first Eisner Award under your tenure. It doesn't list actually what was the first Eisner Award. Is it safe to assume that was probably for like lock and key or something? No, man, that's a great question. What the first one was, I don't know. Like I was, so I was there only about two years after the company started publishing. And so it was the first Eisner, but there wasn't that much material before I started that was submitted to the Eisners. And so yes, it was first, but you know, which isn't to take anything away from.
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previous guy, Jeff Marriott, who was the first editor-in-chief there. He just didn't have as many titles to submit. But yeah, I don't remember what it was. I know we won for Little Nemo and Slumberland with Gabriel Rodriguez, but that would have been some point after. I really don't know what the first one is. Certainly Scott Doombier has racked up a thousand and one artist edition Eisners and other such awards. But yeah, so anyway, yeah, it was nice to at least whatever it was to
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preside over it. And I'm also impressed that right now the Wiki information is, seems like it's pretty accurate. Yeah, big shout out to this anonymous Wiki writer. Okay, what else do they got here? So we got that. Under your tenure at IDW, published the first ever interlicense crossover, they don't go into what it was exactly, and the first ever Doctor Who crossover. Any thoughts on that? Or anything come up? Yeah, the first, the former was Infestation, which was...
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For a while, I'd wanted, you know, because as a kid, like I grew up reading crossovers and loving that kind of thing. And then for a while, Marvel and DC stopped doing that. And so I thought, well, I want to see if I can make some of that stuff happen. We've got, at this point had Hasbro, we had Transformers and Jedi Joe, we had Star Trek, we had Ghostbusters, and a number of other licenses. So I thought, well, wouldn't it be great to pull all of those into one storyline? And it took like a year to convince all those different licensors, like why they should play well with others, why they should.
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I mean, it sort of gets too much behind the curtain, but like why they should split royalties with all these others because instead of a full Transformers comic gives them their full royalty, whereas if it's a crossover, they're splitting it with, you know, the Sony who owns Ghostbusters or, you know, CBS Paramount who owns Star Trek and all of that. So it really did take about a year to convince them that, well, sometimes you do things because they're fun and the fans would dig it and it sort of like elevates all the brands at once. And so, you know, it took some...
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It took some doing and some talking and, but like once Hasbro agreed, then the others like, oh, I, okay, I guess it's safe for us too. I can only imagine like a bunch of like old dusty men in suits and ties scratching their head and when you bring up the word fun, hey, it'd be fun. Fun? What is that? That don't sound like- Well, it's funny. So it's that, but also there are times like, well, yeah, but also like speaking of like guys in suits or even just like corporate execs and such.
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We'd be sitting around meeting tables, you know, talking about things that you would discuss even things like, well, I don't know if we okay, we can't say shit, but can we say, so you're discussing like what level of profanity you can use or you're like, how are these real legitimate conversations that all these like corporate guys are getting paid to discuss? And it at times like the ridiculousness of it all like just seizes you and makes you laugh but that's kind of the fun of it too. Yeah, I'm a little familiar with like some of those talks. I work for a big insurance company.
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And I work in marketing, specifically brand. So we're very protective about our logo, the way certain copy is portrayed when we do partnerships. And some of those meetings are, it's just like, oh my god, why are we still talking about the smallest thing? But yeah, that's just how some of those meetings go. Yeah, yeah. And so the other was the Doctor Who crossover. And so yeah, the Doctor Who had never really wanted or allowed their.
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different iterations of the doctors to meet each other in one storyline. It was always like, no, no, the doctor regenerated. So now it's only the ninth doctor, tenth doctor. And so we finally found a storyline that let us bring different doctors sort of into the same big event. And they said, you know, we've never done this before in any form, in book form, or TV or anything. And so, yeah, we're allowing this to happen. So it's always fun when you can get those little victories to talk them into a thing. Then after the fact, they go, oh, yeah, that was pretty fun. I don't know why we were so...
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uptight about it. You're like, I don't either, but see, like you can do cool stuff that just makes people like you a little bit more. And you were doing this as a publisher, right? Like that was the role that you were in to get all these licenses and everyone to play together nicely. Was that it? I mean, at that point, we didn't really have a publisher. Like the CEO of the company, Ted Adams, who's one of the founders, was also the publisher. So, I mean, there was such overlap between what he and I did. So, there was a lot of...
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back and forth between who's talking to this license or now, what license we're going after next. But I was doing a lot of the day-to-day meetings with everybody in the pitches and getting up there and Don Drapering, here's what we would do with your stuff. Here's how we would make it cool and all that. Well, I ask because it sounds like there's a skill there that's very important that I don't hear mentioned much when it comes to the interviews I have of your typical writer and artist because it's such a...
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kind of like a silo position, like those jobs, but versus being a little more forward-facing, I guess customer-facing, whatever, working with other brands and companies or whatnot, like the skill there being maybe a heavier emphasis on presentation, people skills, being able to talk and present and facilitate things like that. Yeah, I mean, it's funny, it's never my comfort level to get up in front of a room
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do that. But like when you're excited about the thing and you've got cool artwork to show and you're like, no, no, we could make your brand better. We could make the Transformers even more popular with these fans. If we just did this, just let us do this thing. And so then you get like real passionate about showing like why it's good for them. And I mean, for the most part, the licenses we dealt with were really great about that. Like they were sort of past the, I don't know, renaissance of like in the 80s. It was just like, just sell toys. We just want toys.
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It's a 30 page ad for toys. We don't care about anything else but that. And now they kind of moved into this period of like, well, if the comics make us look good, that's just gonna help everything. So let's tell good stories and build out characters. And now like everybody also is always eyeing the movie. So like if you do comics, that's good proof of concept for the people making the films and all that. So they kind of get the story aspect in ways that they didn't used to. And so it's certainly easier to have a license like that who...
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kind of understand and also encourage like playfulness and inventiveness and stuff. You know, speaking about playfulness and then you also bringing up, you know, comics being a means to sell toys as well. To go back to that Simon Furman thing, you know, working with him to do the first Transformers film prequel. Like I said, I had a chance to interview him for the last episode and he was extremely kind, super knowledgeable. Like I listened back to that episode and I'm like, man.
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If I was more knowledgeable about Transformers lore, I could have gone down so many different rabbit holes. But I'm curious from your experience, what was it like working with Simon Furman, who I feel like is, this dude is like almost underrated how like talented and important he is, you know, to like kind of single-handle, no, not single-handle, but you know what I mean, like to build the Transformers lore that we know to have written so many like issues of Transformers. What was it like working with, you know, a living legend?
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He's the best. And he's such a nice guy. I love working with Simon. I love talking to Simon. I love sitting with Simon when we'd be at conventions together and stuff. The greatest guy, and you're right, Larry Hama is rightfully praised for the way he's guided G.I. Joe, a real American hero, and from its inception. He's what gave them characters and made them characters people cared about instead of just pieces of plastic. And he's been doing that for 40 years.
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Simon has been working on Transformers in some form or another for decades, but I think because he either Transformers didn't have as sustained a run as the Real American Heroes series did, you know, now it's up over 300 issues, even though it's changed a couple of publishers' hands. But Larry gets talked about in ways that I think Simon also deserves to get talked about in that same sort of breath. Like Bob Budiansky was there. He was kind of the Larry Homme at the start for Marvel, helped name and define some of the characters.
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breathed real life into them and just, I don't know, made the characters so much more resonant. So when we were first getting the license, like you sometimes wanted to start over and start fresh and do something all new. Then you're like, no, we got to bring in Simon. Like Simon's the best at this and Simon's who the fans are going to respond the best to. And so that totally proved itself out. And so then like co-writing the Transformers movie prequel with him. I mean, I did it in part because I wanted to write.
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write a Transformers comic. And also it was easier with NDAs and secrecy and everything, it was easy to keep it somewhat in-house. But after about issue one or two where I suggested a few things, and every issue Simon took a heavier hand and I wanted him to do that because he's just better at it. But it was great to just get to work on it with him for a few issues.
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And I guess that kind of rounds out my list of firsts cause you mentioned the crossover infestation which I've got here, a paired Transformers, Star Trek, Ghostbusters, and GI Joe, an adventure with your own zombies versus robots creation which is an epic, just reading that out loud is epic. I'm gonna have to find that and put that in my cart. But I guess after hearing, you know, doing that little walk down memory lane, where do your ideas come from? Like what are you inspired by? And most importantly, what kind of lessons
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have you learned being the first to do so many things? So sort of answering in reverse order. When I was a kid, like I used to read licensed comics and they were largely shitty or they, you know, some were good, but they didn't always get the top talents because the top talents were doing Batman and Spider-Man, and you know, the characters that these companies owned. And so they would put sort of available talent or you know, the talent that weren't necessarily the top at the companies at the time.
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to do licensed material or like I say, they were used to sell toys. And so I wanted the licensed stuff to matter to people. I wanted it to matter as much as like an issue of Spider-Man or Batman, because IDW didn't have big corporate titles and sort of well-established characters like Spider-Man as our own. We thought, well, we need to treat all these licenses as like they're just as important like their characters we own because that's what's gonna make people care about them. And so what I learned is like,
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there's always new things to do with titles and characters, even if they've been around forever. Star Trek had been around since late 60s. They started doing comics right after the TV show in mid 60s. And so there was already like, what, 35, 40 years, whatever it was, of comics before we started publishing them. But we did an issue of Klingons in the Klingon language. We had it translated to actual Klingon.
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You know, we did this Harlan Ellison story that had never been told in, in like with his original script to just finding new ways to sort of reinvigorate these older properties, these legacy properties, I think is a thing that I learned that if you really care about them, like you got to kind of come at it first, my point of caring, you know, if you're doing something just because it's going to make you some money, like fans are going to realize that you don't care about it because it's like your passion kind of comes through to them. And so,
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That was always our initial drive. It was like, all right, do we like this enough to want to live with it for a few years? And wait, there was a second question. Actually, there was a first question that I answered out of order and now I've since forgotten. That's all good. I was asking the line of questions, where do your ideas come from? What are you inspired by? Yeah, it's funny. It's almost every comic I've written that wasn't tied in with like a licensed property or a book adaptation or something.
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or aliens or some combination thereof. And so, I don't know, my ideas kind of come from my interest and I was like a UFO kid and you know, I always liked horror novels and horror movies and things like that. And so, those kind of formed the basis for all the sort of stories I want to tell. Like I always start out wanting to tell a story that is just characters and sort of premise and you know, maybe a real world setting and then you're like, it'd be more interesting with a monster. And so, you then you like layer the.
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genre element onto it. So almost everything I do has that genre element added to it because I just find that sort of more fun to play in. So I don't know, my ideas I guess come from the stuff I've always loved. Now, can you recall what was the first comic book that you got a hold of? Or maybe the one that made you like, the one that started this journey, this fandom for you. Can you recall that memory? I can, it's back over there. It's Fantastic Four 130, which was...
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There were these older kids when I was like four years old. And these older kids down the block had stacks of old comics all over their bedrooms, we'd go play with them. And I found this fantastic floor. I was like, I don't know what's going on here, but there was, they were fighting the frightful force. So there was like seven or eight characters on the cover. And you know, there's a flaming guy and a guy made a rock and a guy stretching, the guy made a sand and other people flying and you don't do so with their living hair. And I'm just like, I don't know what this is, but just like.
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inject this in my veins. I need more of this." It just immediately captivated me and kickstarted this love of comics before I could even actually really read the words. Yeah, that was the one. I still actually got that. I stole the comic from those kids eventually because I was like, they don't appreciate this comic. They're never going to miss it. The shit scattered all over their room. So I just brought it home one day. Casual fans. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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So I still have it. So I actually, funny, I found the guy a few years ago. He tracked me down on social media and I was like, hey man, I should fess up. I stole this old comic years and I still have it. You want it back? He's like, no, no man, I'm so glad I found a good home. That's cool. Fun fact, do you know who, actually I'm curious now because Chris, I have a feeling that, I made a joke about being an amateur Marvel historian, but I have a feeling I'm dealing with a professional Marvel historian here. Can you recall who did the cover for this? Cause I'm- Oh, Jim Sterenko.
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Oh yeah, Jim Stranko and Joe Synnett. Yeah. Damn right. Yeah. All right. And interiors, who was the writer and artist for this one? Oh, the artist was John Buscema. It was John Buscema and Joe Synnett. The writer, God, 130, it was probably Jerry Conway. I'll give you a hint. No, it was Roy Thomas. There we go. Ding, ding, ding. That's a good one. Was it Roy Thomas? Yeah, you were right. Yeah. Those guys would like alternate issues all the time. And it was weird because they had like multiple writers they would switch every month. But there was like...
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a consistency of tone and storytelling. They all read a completely single entity wrote this thing. I was always amazed by that going back as an adult. It's really seamless. Now when somebody else jumps onto a book, stylistically it's so different, but it was like they all kind of wrote the same. Maybe they're all just following that Stan Lee blueprint or something but it was hard to tell one from the other at that point.
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that love for comics, that interest for comics, where is the turning point for you where this becomes a viable and real career? Was it in 2002 when Kevin Smith had you to be the editor for the website or was there another point for you? It was, so it was that, yeah. Like before that I'd written, I mean I tried writing and drawing my own comics as a kid and I realized I was a terrible artist and then I'd write up the occasional pitches and mail them off to Marvel and DC and never hear back. Or I would...
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enter the Wizard magazine talent contests, just all these things that never led anywhere. So, I was writing things like ad copy and training videos for car companies and things like that. So, it was like writing, but writing I just hated. So, on the side, I started writing comic reviews online. It was like sort of in the earlier days of, I don't know, comic reviews and commentary and everything like that. So, Kevin Smith found one, sort of took exception to it.
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told me why my opinion was wrong. And like, we kind of went back and forth on that. And eventually after a few months of just like, kind of arguing and then kind of getting friendly and then joking with each other over a couple of months, he asked me to run this website for him. Through the website, I met a few comic people, most notably at the time was Steve Niles, who was IDW's big writer at the time. And he made the introduction IDW. And so yeah, my first job was basically editor-in-chief at IDW.
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thanks to Niles making that intro. Wow, that's a really cool series of events. Now, if you had to sum up or name four comics that define your taste in comic books and storytelling and your preference when it comes to comic books, what do I need to throw in this imaginary blender to get the perfect comic for Chris Ryle? All right, well, let me think. We didn't plan this ahead of time, so I don't have an easy answer, right? So just thinking this through aloud,
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So my all-time favorite storyline is Frank Miller and David Mazza Kelly's Daredevil Born Again, which I just find is like the high watermark of superhero comics. So I'd put that in the mix. I would probably throw Preacher in there because that's kind of off-kilter dark humor of Garth Ennis' comic is certainly a thing that I just found really resonant and sort of matched my own sensibilities. I would throw Alan Moore's Swamp Thing in there for...
31:39
Not necessarily the same reason, but I just find that also, he just made me reconsider what comics could be. And even comics published under Marvel and DC just became something so much more in that particular series. And then, God, I don't know. I guess I'd probably have to put another Marvel title in there because Fantastic Four, from my early childhood up through, when I went back and read the Stanley Jack Kirby stuff, the John Byrne stuff,
32:08
left a big mark on me and sort of all through my childhood, that was my favorite book just because it was my first and so it was one that always just mattered a lot to me. So I guess I'd probably throw all of those at first, but I would also have to add things like I don't know Ninja Turtles showing me that indie comics could be something so different. That was also a comic that made you think like, not that what they did was easy, but it made you think like, all right, well, those are just two kids doing this.
32:37
I could maybe do that someday if I really apply myself. It was approachable. The barrier to entry was realistic at this point. It wasn't hidden behind big publishers or gatekeepers. It was like, oh, if they can do it, respectfully, I can do it. And I think a lot of people would do it. That's totally it. Yeah. Well, yeah, because I think a lot of us felt like we needed permission. We needed to send off samples and have Marvel DC anoint us. It was like, you are now a comic writer. And then Kevin and Peter were like...
33:05
we're just going to go make comics. We don't need their permission. That opened a ton of doors. There's a lot more along the way, but I think formative years, those are the kind of things that really left a mark on me. All of those together probably make this. Okay. I think this is a good point as any to pivot to the main topic, even though I can go down this rabbit hole even more. We're here to talk about the mighty Marvel
33:34
calendar book, a visual history, which is on sale right now. If you're watching the YouTube version, my man Chris has got the book in hand showing it off. For the audio listeners, I do have a link to the Amazon listing in the show notes, but I know I'm getting my copy through my local comic shop. I advise maybe you go support your local comic shop and get this book as well. Like I had said in the intro, it's a glorious hardcover book.
34:02
I cannot wait to get my copy in my hand, but you were kind enough to send me an advance review copy, a PDF copy, and just a digital version. I know anytime that I love a digital version, I know I'm going to love the physical. And it's coming out through Abrams, which has got a high reputation for putting out some amazing books like this. So I guess let's just start off with the basics. How did this book come about? In your words, what is it about?
34:30
I mean, it came about first when I was a kid. Like I had some of these calendars, my brother, my older brother had some of these calendars. And so I would see these on the wall. And I'm like, God, I love those calendars so much. Because unlike most calendars, which were always just like sort of a generic piece of art, and then a white grid of squares, you know, that may be listed, I don't know, a couple holidays or like daylight savings time and stuff like that, like Marvel treated every bit of the calendar, like cover to cover as a piece of art in the way they treated their comics the same way. And so-
34:58
The calendar grid became these things where every square had a bit of information, a quote from a comic or a bit of trivia about that old comic. It had early picture creators, which when I was a kid, I didn't know who anybody was or what they looked like. These little black and white pictures were the only time you saw what anybody that made the comics looked like. All of it together just became this cool artifact that even after the...
35:27
After the calendars expired, every now and every six, seven years, whatever it was, the calendars would line up again, the day and date would line up again, so I'd hang them on my wall over again. At IDW, I wanted to do a book based on these because I never saw them reprinted. I'm like, there's a ton of great art in there, like Bill Sikkevich and Jack Kirby and John Byrne and Frank Miller and George Perez, on and on and on, all these great artists. A murderer's row of the all-time.
35:54
greats like, you know, like Mount Rushmore galore when you think of like great comic book artists. Yeah. And so it's always like, well, why have the world not seen these things? Why are they not reissued or somehow collected? And so I tried to get that done at IDW and it didn't work for various reasons. Part of it was, was just the reproduction was challenging because those old counters are spiral bound and you either had to tear it apart, which then risk tearing it. Anyway, the production end of it was
36:22
a challenge. I worked with a guy named David Banks who helped me do the scanning, the restoration, the cleanup and everything. We didn't do cleanup and that we didn't change the colors to modern. We made sure that we kept the look and feel of the old calendars, but just made them look the best possible versions of them. The greatest thing about it is we produced them at the size they were made. They were 12 by 12 calendars. The book is this 13 by 13 hardcover behemoth.
36:49
It's like getting a large pizza, you know, but it weighs 10 pounds. It's not as tasty. Yeah, yeah, right. Although there's some tasty stuff in there, I got to say. Yeah, for the eyeballs. And I underwrist all this old, this old, like, behind the scenes stuff too, like these old memos and letters from the staff to Stan Lee or the process stuff or...
37:13
And you know, you said something about, I'm sorry, you said something about this being an artifact and I literally have a note here that it feels like I'm looking at a pop art, like a pop art artifact. And I mean that in the most respectful way considering, you know, sometimes the negative connotations that come with pop art. But it feels like I'm looking at this artifact that is teleporting me and giving me so much insight into the mind of, you know, editorial.
37:39
And it almost treats like I'm looking at Marvel as like an art house with through reading this book. Right. Like I know now the general process of how a comic book is made and the different hands it goes through. But this is interesting to get the behind the scenes story because this isn't so, especially when you think about what, 1975 is the first calendar that came out. Like there is no template to follow. So.
38:05
To get like the behind the scenes. And no computers. So they're cutting this stuff up. Like the manual production work to make these things seems so lopsided versus... You would look at that today on a P&L and you'd be like, I don't know, the amount of hours it's going to take to make this, the amount of money we're going to make, we can't justify it. Well said. But I don't think... They were just like, let's make something cool. Exactly. And so some of the stuff I found, this doesn't help the people that are just listening to the audio. But I had these like...
38:34
hand-drawn pieces that the original editors that worked on the calendar did where they drew out by hand what they wanted the art to look like, then handed it to an artist. But they also drew every single square of every single month by hand what they wanted. Yeah. And so then the production department had to go- And is this from Roy Thomas? Because I know he did the first- This is from David Anthony Kraft, who did the 78 and 79 calendars. But I mean, he did every single month to this elaborate degree of detail.
39:02
by hand. And so the cool thing is that we've got some of those reproduced in the back of the book. So you can see just the amount of care and time and like what a massive labor of love these things were back then. Well said. Labor of love is a great way to put it. And such a big flex, just like brand, design, especially like design wise, some of these designs and layouts, compositions, the color combinations like still hold up so strong. And I think it's just a testament to just how good the art was.
39:32
The caliber of artists at the time, I think the timelessness of these character designs and just how iconic they are and how they work so well in the hands of the artists and the right, I don't know, it is a lesson in just design, creativity 101. Yeah, it was just they were just trying stuff. I think that's the exciting thing is they just tried stuff and it worked for the most part.
39:59
And you know, and something you said too about like how, how these calendars stand out, aside from like obviously the art, but the personality that's injected in them, right? Like the decision by Roy Thomas in that first calendar to, you know, like, like you said, do something with the actual dates, like to inject the personality of the bullpen, like, hey, you know, on this date is whatever, John Bezema's birthday and oh, Jack Kirby, you know, did this on this day, or Fantastic Four, issue 12 came out. You know, like that is such a, you know, it's just kind of,
40:29
It's like a vehicle for the ethos of the Marvel bullpen at the time. And all the things that you liked about Marvel, well, I guess I can only imagine. I was a kid. Not even probably born then. Yeah, I wasn't even born then. But it's like a vehicle of why I think Marvel succeeded so well in the 70s was because of the personality they had, the cool fact.
40:50
Yeah, so yes, and that totally comes through. The humor, and I mean, some of it's like, it feels like daddy humor, you know? Like it's goofy jokes or like these puns and these grown worthy sort of comments. But the thing that they really had honed at that point, yeah, but also years ago, I tried doing this with the Hasbro because eventually we had had My Little Pony and ROM and Micronauts and GI Joe and Transformers. I'm like, all right, that's enough properties that we could make a Hasbro version of these old Marvel calendars.
41:19
And so I started working on it and I was just like, not only is this a colossal amount of work that was hard to like find time to do, but also like finding that right sense of humor that was sort of funny and engaging, but also wasn't insulting or didn't sort of mock the brands. Like it's such a fine line that they drew and it's a very specific tone that they struck that, you know, was self-deprecating but not mocking. And so yeah, just...
41:48
Everything about it just impressed me that they just created this thing that didn't exist and made it by hand. And then, you know, their production department got to work cutting out images and pasting stuff up and making these cool things that finally we can like show to people to remind them how good they were. Yeah. Okay. So I want to share something with you because I got excited about, I think I, you know, I had emailed you and I was like, Chris, I just realized that the book I pre-ordered is written by you.
42:17
And what you don't know is that last year I had met a comic collector here in Jacksonville. And his name is Tony. I cannot forget his last name. He's since moved from Jax, I think somewhere else, but he's always at HeroesCon. And he has some of the coolest just like comic things. Aside from like a bunch of back issues, he's got things like, you know, epic magazine and you know, a bunch of like old comic fanzines.
42:47
And then he also has like, you know, like my, the merry Marvel marching band, you know, box kid and old things like that. But among those things that he, that he had last year was these Marvel calendars. And that was my first like, wow, these are epic. So I went ahead and grabbed the one that I bought from him. And it is- Oh, you got the goofiest one of all. Girls, can I say that reading through this book, I'm like,
43:12
damn, I should have tried to look for the 75 one. Damn, I really want the, you know, these other, but now I'm on this quest to search for these other ones. But the one that I currently own, and I'm holding it up for the video listeners, for the video viewers, is the 1976 calendar, which was the bicentennial calendar. So everything inside of this calendar is themed around America and the revolution and et cetera. And I was curious, because I got to this chapter in the book, I said, you know what, I'm a hold off on this. I want to be surprised when I ask Chris this.
43:41
What can you tell me about this particular calendar? Any fun facts or how it came to be or anything that might be cool to hear? Yeah, so I mean in 1976, yeah, so that was America's 200th birthday. So they were doing all these celebratory things like Jack Kirby was back on Captain America. And so they did this like caps bicentennial battles, big oversized treasury edition that Jack put together. And so this was also trying to celebrate that bicentennial. So what they did was they dropped Marvel characters into
44:09
the Revolutionary War. So every image in that calendar is like, I don't know, like the Hulk stomping around Gettysburg or the Avengers crossing the Potomac with Washington or whatever the case may be. It was just like some of the goofiest things like Black Panther from Africa is now fighting in America's Revolutionary War. It's so anachronistic and everything. The funny thing is, so I talked to...
44:38
Tony Isabella, who's the writer and the editor who put that calendar together. And he goes, oh man, there's probably stuff in there that I don't want to revisit. It's probably embarrassing or it's probably culturally made references and things that... Yeah. So it's such an artifact of its time. But just like, I don't know, seeing the Hulk in Valley Forge and shredded revolutionary garb and stuff like that is... I don't know. The images are...
45:06
like not only great because of the artists involved, but also just so silly in such a moment in time that, yeah, that one above all else like stands out as just this like this thing that you'll never see happen again. I think maybe that's why he sold, Tony sold it to me for so cheap. Well, yeah, I can't wait to buy some of these other, the fun fact for those that maybe are going on eBay right now, looking up some of these old calendars, the originals are, you know, depending on which one you get kind of run you up.
45:35
50 bucks on up. But fun fact, they're actually re-releasing the 1975, the very first Mighty Marvel calendar for a 2025 edition, I think, come January, if I'm not mistaken. You got any info? It's actually out now. They came out last summer. But the dates, the 1975 dates do line up with 2025. So when I was doing the book, I was talking Abrams, I go, hey guys, the dates match, you could reissue.
46:02
they got all excited about it. So they reissued the actual calendar. They gave it the spiral binding and everything that the old one had. And so yeah, you can hang the old one on your wall and you know what day and date it is accurately. Okay, so among the offerings of the book, so aside from a very good looking book, well laid out, well designed book, I think we mentioned there is behind the scenes stories, there is infographics, there's everything you would wanna know about.
46:30
these calendars as well as like what was going on with Marvel at the time. There's just a lot, this book is chock full of that information. One thing I want to highlight is that it comes with a foreword by Roy Thomas who, you know, legendary Marvel editor, writer, Marvel historian at that, talk about a professional story and that's like the man when it comes to Marvel history. And I was curious from your perspective, you know, a fellow editor, yourself, writer, etc.
46:56
What was it like working with Roy? Like, what did you learn from him? What was it like having him, like, you know, share these stories and have him walk down, you know, memory lane when it comes to this? Yeah, I mean, so Roy was the first writer editor on this calendar. So it was basically his idea. Well, I'm assuming it was his idea. I mean, there are things that, you know, Roy has, when Roy has talked about his involvement into creation of various things, there's been various controversies associated with some of those claims. The lines get blurred sometimes, yeah.
47:25
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's hard to know fact from fiction at times. But in this one, he was the writer-editor of the calendar. So to have him talk about, I don't know, Marvel at the time, and he was the editor-in-chief at the time, and just the guy that got it all started was very exciting that he's still around to share his experiences and do the introduction and talk about all the behind-the-scenes stuff in the making of that calendar was a thrill. Roy was one of the very first comic writers.
47:54
that I ever read as a kid, like I love his stuff. And so, you know, on a book like this, it was important that, you know, the guy that got it all started was also asked to participate in the book that sort of celebrated what he got started. Now, what would you say is your, actually, you know what? I want to ask that because I have someone else to ask this. We're going to take just a slight.
48:19
We're gonna take a quick little detour. Chris, for you, I have decided, I've done this before, but I actually am naming this segment. We're gonna go into a segment I'm now dubbing the Ghosts from Short Box Pass. Oh man. So this will be a segment I do on interviews like this, where I reach out to past guests, friends of the show and Short Box alumni, call on their show to ask questions and hang out in spirit. They can't be here physically, but they can hang out in spirit. And I have two ghosts from Short Box Pass.
48:49
I'm not even, I'm not even gonna ruin the surprise. Let's just play these voice messages I got. And there's some questions for you to follow up. And I think this one is related to the Mighty Marvel calendar. So here we go. I love it. This is a voice from your present, Chris.
49:08
It's Ian. Hey, man. I had something really clever to say, but it got away from me. Something about the head leader of Galador requesting that you return home to suit up for space night duty to fight the Dire Wraiths. But again, it got away from me. So I'm going to leave you this kind of lame message. Hey, I am glad that you hooked up with Bader and the crew on the Short Box podcast. Great team.
49:38
And hey, just wanted to say hello and you are a pleasure to work with my man. And I look forward to working on many, many projects moving forward. Great plans, great things ahead. Peace. Wow. Okay. So he brought, he brought that one home at the end. I like it. Yeah. Ian's awesome. Come on, a little ROM reference for you. Now, for those that might not be familiar, that was Ian Chalgrin. I had him on the show last October on episode four of seven. We had him to come on to talk about.
50:07
an art book that he was working on at the time of the uncanny covers ocular edition. Since then, he has gone on to be a really badass designer and for those watching video, Chris is holding up a book that Ian and Chris worked on together called the origins of Marvel comics by Stan Lee, which I guess Chris, you do the honors. What exactly is that book? What was it like working with Ian who's relatively still like young in terms of like comic industry terms but
50:36
One hell of an eye when it comes to design and graphics. One hell of an eye. He's so good. And it's funny, I only got to know him because he sent me a book that he mocked up out of the blue knowing that I love ROM. Like years ago, he sent me just as proof of concept as a designer. That's right, the Sal Basheema book, right? Yeah, yeah. That's right, yeah. And it was great. And so I've been wanting to find ways to work with him. So once I left IDW and started the imprinted image, then there were finally some opportunities and we've been doing more and more.
51:05
books and more archival books and more sort of high-end cool stuff like, like you say, this Marvel Comics book, which, so this was another thing like the calendars that when I was a kid, this was a book that just like, I read it constantly. It was a, it basically featured origin stories of sort of all the big Marvel characters at the time. So it was Spider-Man, Spider-Man Hulk, Thor, Doctor Strange, Fantastic Four, all in one book and it was the very first time Marvel's comics had ever been collected in like a nice bookstore library edition. So as a kid...
51:35
you go to the library, find this book and just read it incessantly. And so for years, I'd wanted to bring that book back into print too. And finally got a chance to do that through Simon & Schuster's gallery line. So Ian was my designer, Alex Ross did the cover, and we brought in like all kinds of essays and other contributors to do cool pieces that talk about the book, like Larry Lieber, who worked on the first issue of Thor alongside Stanley and Jack Kirby.
52:02
the book's original editor, Alex Ross did a couple pieces, Tom Brevoor, like it was just a blast to put together and include, kind of like the calendar book, all this like behind the scenes and, you know, backup material, just to flesh out the contents of the original book itself. Yeah, how much of this stuff did you already know? Like going into that book or the Mighty Marvel calendar, like how much of this was already in your head? How much of this history did you already commit to memory or versus like how much, or did you have to do a lot of research and?
52:31
you know, digging through books. I do a lot of research just to not only, you know, make sure that my facts are accurate. I have a lot of just stuff lodged in my head from, you know, decades of reading this stuff. But you know, you want to make sure that you're accurate in the art credits and the things you're saying about the books or sort of the stories you've heard from others along the way that you want to sort of verify their accuracy and all of that. And so yeah, I did deep dives on everything.
53:00
finding all the letters and memos. A lot of that stuff I'd never seen before. Certainly the hand-drawn sketches and stuff like that I'd never seen before. And so, yeah, it's fun when you can just kind of dig in on your own, but then also when you tell certain people that are in the business or that know this stuff, then they start offering up help or offering up other people that know things and it just kind of becomes like this whispered network of people that can help sort of flesh out all the behind the scenes details. Okay.
53:29
Now, I have one more. Well, not one more. I actually have technically three voice messages from this one particular ghost of Short Box Pass. And I'm very excited for you to hear this one. So let's play his first voice message slash question, which I think actually ties to the Mighty Marvel calendar. I mixed it up with Ian, but here we go.
53:48
I have a few questions for crazy comic columnist Chris Ryle. First, what's your favorite month in the calendar and why? Now Chris, for those that might not be familiar with that voice right there, because I don't think he states his name, can you tell us who that is? That was none other than Lock and Key co-creator Joe Hill, who's done a great many things other than Lock and Key, but that was where I first met him anyway. So yeah, that's the great Joe Hill. So that was very nice of him to ask that question.
54:18
The answer has to be October in all those calendars because October and I think just about every one of them, maybe not 1981, they did like a cool Halloween scene. So you got, I don't know, a Gene Cole and Dracula piece. You got Mike Plough drawing like all the Marvel monsters. And so there's a George Perez Spider-Man sort of surrounded by all of his villains with the moon large in the background. And so every October, there's like this cool Halloween themed piece in each of the calendars. And so...
54:46
That was the one that, you know, as a kid and as an adult, always stood out to me the most. Chris, I'm gonna put you on the spot here, but we keep bringing up all these like iconic artists and these illustrations. If you had to make a Mount Rushmore of your all time favorite comic artists, who would be on there? What four comic artists come to mind? Oh God. Well, so I have, there'd be multiple Mount Rushmores because they're the people that like, the foundational people in the business, like Jack Kirby, who...
55:13
That's a whole separate and higher, that's like Mount Olympus. Oh, well said. I might have to actually borrow that going forward. That's a good one. Who's on the Mount Olympus? Yeah, so that's the Pantheon, but I wouldn't necessarily pick those guys as my childhood favorites because they weren't the people I read first. And so it was the people that really resonated to me as a kid. So that was very quickly, I can name two, John Byrne and George Perez were the first two guys that I looked at their stuff and I could tell.
55:41
something about what they were doing was different and better than a lot of the other guys. You know, even before I write new to recognize creator names or knew that different people drew these things, there was something about like, I'd read one of their old comics, but there's something here that stands out in ways that others don't. And so they're certainly on there. I would have to put Bill Sinkiewicz on there as a guy that opened my eyes and like the entire industry's eyes when he started to.
56:10
that comics could be something different. You know, like what he was doing was so different and unique and cool and just, I don't know, outside the lines of what you thought comics could be. That he'd be on that list and, or he'd be on that mountain anyway. It's funny, because now my fourth person is actually like a three or four headed monster on his own.
56:36
But rather than cheating that way, I'll say it has to be Sergio Aragonese, who from my earliest days of reading Mad Magazine and then Grew the Wanderer and everything, just that guy and what he's done and how quickly he's done it and how prolifically he's done it. And just what a great guy he is too, just sort of one of the all-time spirits of comics, just one of the best people ever to work in his business. I think he's also gotta be up there. Which leaves out...
57:06
so many others. Neil Adams, I think, would be on the Olympus, not the Rushmore and all of that. And so, like they say, there's a lot of mountains, but probably those four would be on my Rushmore anyway. Solid. Solid listening and great justification for that. All right. Let's get back to Joe Hill's questions. He's got two more for me. Let me go and queue up the second one. Okay. Next question. Who would win in a fight? John Ramita Sr. Spider-Man or Todd McFarlane's Spider-Man?
57:36
Huh. I mean, Todd McFarlane's Spider-Man could contort his body in unnatural ways. And so I think maybe he'd be harder to beat for that reason. But I don't know, Romita's Spider-Man was bulky, you know? Right? Ditko was the spidery, you know, weird athletic. Yeah, but then Romita's like, oh wait, when did he get so thick? Looking through the calendar book, you realize, especially when it comes to like Romita and like Usama, there is something about the...
58:05
just how much mass their figures have. You look at those figures, their drawings, you're like, no, that guy could definitely bench 500 pounds. The tonality, the muscle mass. I'm edging a little more towards senior, or donner me to senior Spider-Man, because I feel like once he has a hold of McFarlane Spider-Man, it's a wrap. McFarlane Spider-Man might be a little more agile, but I don't know if he can pack that same punch. Yeah, no, no. McFarlane's is more like,
58:34
like Vince Vaughn and swingers. But then Romita's is like Vince Vaughn and I don't know, wedding crashes or whatever. He's just thicker. Plus, Peter Parker back then wrote a motorcycle.
58:51
probably at his relative coolest at that point. So I think you got to go with Romita. Yeah. And his best looking too. No offense to McFarland's Spider-Man or Peter Parker, but Romita's senior, Peter Parker was a damn movie star model. However, McFarland's webbing could beat Romita's webbing. So it's almost a watch. I can see that, yeah. All right, last but not least, one more question from our friend Joe Hill. Here we go. Finally, who had the better sleaze stash?
59:19
70s era Burt Reynolds, 70s era Tony Stark, or 70s era Stan Lee. Oh, I mean, it's- Let me tell you real quick, Chris. I thought, I reached out to Joe and Ian. Ian was like, hey, give me a couple of days. I want to think of something good. And I was like, oh, Joe, I was like, if Joe even responds, I'll be impressed. If he even has time, I'll be impressed.
59:44
It was the fastest turnaround I've ever had doing one of these like reach outs and segments. He had three questions lined up ready to go. And I was like, has he just, has he always pondered these questions? He's pondered them. I was gonna say he's obviously pondered the mustache thing. And so 70s Tony Stark had, it was like a little more penciled. You know, it wasn't quite as robust as it became later on. So I think he finishes third in that contest. I think.
01:00:13
It's got to be Burt Reynolds, right? Because we don't totally know that Stan's mustache wasn't an add-on, like a gift of purchase with the toupee, right? The hair wasn't necessarily fully his own. So, maybe the mustache was just an add-on gift when he bought the toupee. Scandalous. Scandalous, Chris. I'm just saying, people are saying that that could be the case. It was probably real, but I think Stan with a beard was tough to beat.
01:00:43
everybody loses to 70s Burt Reynolds. That guy was just, that guy was it in the 70s. Yeah. And his sleaze factor was through the roof. I mean, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well said. Well, I'm going to give a big shout out to Joe Hill and Ian Chowgren for submitting those questions and being a part of the now anointed Ghost from Short Box Pass segment. And Chris, thank you so much for being here. Love that. That was great. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Chris, before I let you go, I want to transition to talking about what you got going on with Scissor G, the imprint that you started.
01:01:13
two years ago with, highly acclaimed, on one of my favorite artists, comic artists out there, Ashley Wood, you guys have been releasing titles such as Zombies Versus Robots, you've got Onyx, The Hollows, Tales of Suspense, and then I believe come next month, you guys are dropping a Christmas horror themed comic called Dread the Halls. Yes, correct. I had a chance to tell you that,
01:01:41
getting ready for this episode, I ended up reading Zombies Versus Robots, volume one, the collected edition for the first time. Thinking that this was like a new book, I'm like, oh, Scissorgey's only been around for two years. You know, this is a pretty new book. Lo and behold, you guys have been writing, you and Ashley would have been doing Zombies Versus Robots stories since like 2011, I think, or something like that? No, no, 2006, even worse. Okay. Obviously, well behind, but man, can I just go ahead and say,
01:02:11
That is such a fun comic book. Like the premise is so, I mean, it's- It's stupid. It's quite stupid, right? Like- What's stupid? Fun, my friend, you forgot that last part. That was the goal, yeah. Stupid, fun. It's exactly what's on the cover. Much like going to a gas station buying an Arizona can of iced tea, the price is on the cover. You're getting exactly what Chris and Ashley are selling on the cover. It's zombies versus robots, but honestly, the premise is fun. I feel like the-
01:02:39
Your knack for dialogue, man, it's like very lean. It's very lean, but gets the point across. And then on top of like Ashley Wood's incredible art, like it's a really fun book, man. And I wanna just hear about Scissor G and your words, like what makes Scissor G, your imprint stand out from other imprints? Like what's the ethos when it comes to the comics that you guys put out and your creative process? Yeah, first of all, thank you. That's very kind of you to say.
01:03:06
I think probably what I try to have brevity in any of the stories is because Ash's stuff is so beautiful. I don't want to cover what he's doing with copious amounts of text, but also the zombies don't talk. So that already immediately eliminates half the characters in the book from having any dialogue. And yeah, we just didn't want to do any kind of ponderous heavy thing with zombies. So we started this in 2006.
01:03:34
Ash was for a while, Ash is Australian citizen, but he was living in San Diego. And so he was in IDW's offices and he goes, hey, why don't you write me something? And I go, all right, well, what do you like to draw? And he goes, I like to draw zombies, I like to draw robots. And so I go, why don't we do zombies versus robots? Because it makes no sense. Like the zombies need human brains to eat. We basically set a world where there's no humans, there's one infant, but otherwise, at least in the first storyline, there's no humans.
01:04:04
Robots basically have no purpose other than what they're programmed to do. And so we wanted a storyline where none of the characters, like the protagonist or antagonist, had a character arc. Like there was no movie in this. It was just like us having fun, which made it even more amusing that like Sony then tried to develop a film based on it, which was funny to us because we kind of set out to make an anti filmable kind of comic. And so we, yeah, we just...
01:04:31
We never take ourselves too seriously. We just try to have fun with these things and Ash makes everything I like envision on paper look so much better when he draws them. And so I'm completely just kind of writing his artistic coattails on this book, but we originally did it, yeah, like starting in 06 at IDW, but then we put out a new edition of the older stuff, but with a bunch of new stuff added to it. That's probably what I read. The scissor gene print. Yeah, yeah. So we've done some other things too. We did a book called Doomed.
01:05:00
where we did old horror stories, kind of like in the vein of creepy and eerie magazine. And so, yeah, we're constantly trying to find new stuff to do together and just, again, just hopefully keep having fun. I guess, is it easier? Do you feel like what you're doing at Scissor G, difficulty-wise, is easier considering you've got over 20 years of experience running a publishing company? Is it easier because it's an imprint or is there still that same...
01:05:27
Whatever, I guess stress and whatnot that comes with the job. It's so much harder, man. It is so much harder and more stressful. How? At IDW, there was a staff. So when stuff needed, eventually, so I was employee number seven. But when I left there, I was overseeing like 70 people. And so there were marketing people and there were business people and there were production people. And now there's me and there's Ash at times when.
01:05:55
But you know, Ash is drawing some of the stuff, but he's not necessarily handling any of the other parts of the publishing. And so, like images there on the back end to help on that part, but it's so much more work, which makes it more gratifying, but also you're like, I wouldn't mind a little bit of help here and there. But the nice thing is like, when you're asking about what sort of books we publish or what our sensibilities are, they are only stuff that we like, which is kind of a simple and not helpful answer to creators like,
01:06:25
they go, what kind of pitches do you want? I'm like, I don't know, just stuff that kind of matches what we do, which is sort of idiosyncratic, kind of off-kilter. When we did Joe Hill's Reign with Zoe Thurgood, it was an art style that wasn't necessarily a style that we've used on any of other Joe's adaptations. But it fit the story perfectly. And of course, Zoe has since exploded in comics, rightfully so. And so finding people like that that are...
01:06:53
very good at doing their own thing, but they're also very unique. They don't look like anybody else's stuff and they've got a particular point of view. And I don't know, again, it kind of comes back to like, would I be proud to have Ashwood seeing this thing and wanting this thing published under his imprint? And so he's kind of my guiding light on all of this.
01:07:16
Let's kind of circle back to the Wikipedia. There was something on there that I wanted to follow up or ask about or even see if it's real. But it mentions that Zombies vs. Robots was optioned by Sony Pictures for Michael Bay's Platinum Dunes with Mike Flanagan as director. Is that true? Is there any, I guess, update on that? Or are we going to get a Zombies vs. Robot movie or something? I don't know. But we did have Mike Flanagan for five minutes, which...
01:07:41
Even then it was epic. But since then, he's certainly gone on to do all kinds of amazing things that will never get Mike Flanagan back on the project. But yeah, in 2010, they optioned it, which was amusing to us because again, we didn't really have a story there that was necessarily workable as a film. There's no human parts. There's maybe voice work, but a big live action movie needs human roles for it to work for the studio. And so they made considerable changes to it, which
01:08:11
some of which were fun, some of which I thought were getting so far away from the premise that it was not necessarily... You just wonder why they wanted zombies versus robots. But every time there was a different director attached, they bring in a new team, they rework the story a bit more. So it's gone through these different iterations. I don't know if it ever happens. It was originally envisioned as like this massive, $100 million plus trilogy kind of thing. Those kind of movies just don't...
01:08:40
get made anymore if it's not based on like a Marvel or DC property. And so I think, yeah, so I think if it's a smaller scale thing, like a down and dirty kind of thing, there's ways to still do it. But I don't know, like it's not dead. And I actually talked to one of the heads at Platinum Dune just a few months ago, who still wants to find a way to do it. So that's at least encouraging. But now we're just trying to figure out like, is there a way to do this that is true to what you know, they want it to be what we would like it to be?
01:09:09
And I hope so. I love that they're still interested in it. And I'm also hopeful that eventually we get back to calling it zombies versus robots again. Like it was renamed early on, Inherit the Earth. And I was like, but like to your point earlier, like the title does your marketing for you. Yeah. So we'll see. OK, I'll keep my fingers and toes crossed. But I will say as a late comer to zombies versus robots, the the collection that that's out there is
01:09:38
is awesome. So I'm glad to have plenty of comic books to read. If you were given like a magic wand or a lamp and you could change one thing about the comic book industry based on like your many years of being in it like hands on and a change that might be like for the better, I guess what would you want to see change in the comic book industry? Well, so a couple things, well, probably more than a couple, but depends how much.
01:10:06
how much money I have then to fix it. But so I mean, part of it is like the two things that I always felt were were my responsibility working in comics was to not only help elevate new talents and give new people opportunities that they didn't otherwise find, but also give back where I can like do the preservation of this stuff in these archival editions or, you know, offer work to people that that helped build a lot of the great comics from years past, but aren't necessarily getting any kind of pain work now.
01:10:35
And so on one front, I want that. I want to be able to sort of help old and new keep making cool stuff and telling good stories. But the other part of it is, I don't know, I think there's a conversation that we as a collective industry don't want to have, which is finding ways to make it make sense in 24 to keep doing the kind of comics and the formats that we're doing. And I get it.
01:11:05
page story, 32 page comic book, because that's what I'm used to. But does that, does a thing that's part one of six that costs $4 or $5 per chapter and is released one issue at a time over six months, does that work for today's audience? And I don't think, in a large measure, it doesn't. It's people that read them that way as kids, maybe still like it that way. But newer kids want a full book, they want a whole story. And so trying to figure out the right way to present this material.
01:11:33
but also the right places to present. How do we make sure that kids who aren't necessarily reading comics now are going to comic book shops? How are they still getting fed this kind of material? Once they've graduated from Dog Man and Wimpy Kid, what's the best way to remind them that graphic novels and graphic storytelling is still a very viable thing for them to continue on with as they age? And so it's that, cultivating that next generation of readers that stick with it beyond childhood. And that's where I think it's getting to be more of a challenge.
01:12:03
outside of like webtoons, which then becomes hard for the creators of that material to actually make a living at it. So it's like, how do we create an ecosystem where people are aware of these things, have access to them the way they want them now, but also in a way that's sustainable enough for the people making them? And there's probably no easy answer. And I think crowdfunding is probably a big part of that at this point too, beyond just the big publishers. So it's, but you know, we all kind of like...
01:12:30
dabble in things that we hope are the right answer, but without sort of collectively talking about like, maybe we should change doing monthly comics into something, but what is that something? And so, like I said, I think there's no easy answers, but there's a conversation that I think needs to keep going on because I want comic stores to continue on too. And they certainly have a harder time because younger people aren't going in as much. And how do we help everybody sort of keep thriving?
01:12:58
in the way that people want to read stories nowadays. What advice would you give to an aspiring comic creator, whether that be like a writer or an artist or just a creator in general? And maybe this could be something about just common mistakes that you see or things from that editor perspective. I guess from an editor perspective, what is some advice that you would give to an aspiring comic creator that would help them maybe break into the industry or fortify their own story and getting their story out?
01:13:27
Yeah, I'd say so there's a couple things I wanted from a broader point of view. Finish stuff when you start it. Um, it's so easy to start things. And I think that's where some people go rise. They'll start drawing a thing or they'll start writing a thing. And then they get excited about their next idea. And I get that and you want to jump onto this hot new thing that you're excited about, but then you don't finish that one and then you don't finish the one before that and suddenly you develop a, a bit of a track record of
01:13:55
walking away from stuff, which just makes it hard to then finish something once you actually get hired to do that if you do. And so the act of actually finishing a thing is one of the hardest things in making anything. And so even if you're not loving this thing, like you'll learn from it and you'll figure out next time, like what to do to sort of improve upon what you did before. But you got to finish the thing to have like a good proof of content to show publishers, to show fans, like to let people read your stuff. You know, just
01:14:22
not abandoning stuff because it's not working, but figuring out why it's not working and seeing it through. And then from a more sort of hands-on perspective, just making sure that what you're doing is readable. It's not too wordy if you're an artist, making sure that you're not trying to dazzle so much in like crazy storytelling with panels going all which ways and characters breaking through panels and stuff like that to try to dazzle visually but at sort of the sake of coherence. You want to make sure that...
01:14:51
your story still reads, you know, literally in the way you want people to like lead their eye and everything. And so just make sure that yeah, what you're doing has a enough coherence to it that if you hand it to somebody, whether it be just a friend or somebody online or an editor, they can easily read it and see what you're trying to do with that story and not, you know what I mean? Because sometimes people try so hard to do every cool visual trick on every page that you kind of lose the story underneath it. And then...
01:15:19
So you find that balance of like, what's cool? When should I break the rules? But when should I also just make sure that I'm telling a story that other people can also follow, if that's your goal. Like sometimes your goal is just to have cool images and words placed around it, that's also fine. And then for both of those groups, the biggest lesson is, like we talked earlier, like you don't need permission to make comics. Like, you know, you don't, there's not an easy path into comics. Like there is with like being a doctor or lawyer, not easy, but I mean, at least sort of straightforward.
01:15:48
But the path in is to just make something. Make a comic and you work in the comic industry. Like you may not make a living at it yet, but that goes a long way to then showing people what you could do and then hopefully working your way up to finding that paying work. So just yeah, make stuff and don't wait for somebody to tell you it's okay. Well said.
01:16:08
Ladies and gents, this is the Short Box Podcast, and we just finished talking with Chris Ryle about his new book, The Mighty Marvel Calendar Book, A Visual History, which is available right now for all you diehard Marvel heads and aspiring and amateur Marvel historians to buy wherever you get your books, and probably at your local comic shop, right? Do me that favor, go check if this book is available at your local comic shop, more than likely they can order it. With that said, I'll have links to the book, I'll have links to where you can follow Chris online in the show notes, his Instagram is.
01:16:35
What were a follow? You share some really cool photos and back stories and projects that you share. So I have that link in the show notes. Please check that out if you're interested. Chris, any parting words, any shameless plugs before we wrap up? Well, so the only other plug at this point because we're pretty plugged out probably, but I run a weeklyish sub stack where I also talk about old comics, new comics, and other things in between. And so there's that, but otherwise the only parting words are a thank you to you.
01:17:03
And also to Joe and to Ian for calling in and participating. That was great. So really enjoyed talking to you today. That was fantastic, man. Thank you. There you have it, ShortBikes Nation. That's the end of the show. Thank you for hanging out. Thanks for being here. And a special shout out if you made it this far. If you enjoyed this episode and you have some thoughts or comments that you want to share with us, write us at theshortbikesjaxx at gmail.com. And if you really liked this episode, help us spread the word.
01:17:31
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01:17:59
It's an easy and very affordable way to support the show and get rewarded for being a fan. Once again, sign up at patreon.com slash the short box. Speaking of our Patreon community, I want to give a big shout out to our current members, including Adam Chittani, Tony Aupi, RC Gamet, Blake Simone, Blythe Brumleaf, Bo Evers, Brian Brumleaf, Chad Lannenberger, Chris Hacker, Chris Jinx, Kenny Myers, David Morales, Triple D Mystic, Dominique Jackson, Errol White, Edbot 5000, and...
01:18:28
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01:18:57
Thanks again to everyone that listens and supports this show. Be sure to come back next week for a new episode. And most importantly, take care of yourselves, read a good comic, and continue to make mine and yours short box. I'll catch you soon. Peace.
